Dealing with a WW Pt3

[Grace21]

So sorry you are hurting. Our situations are tough on "regular" days, but compounded on Holidays, for sure. My H just left after spending overnight here. He seems so sad and broken. I almost feel sorry for him. But, as we watched our kids open gifts this morning, I couldn't help but ask myself why H would want to give up such sweet times together.

Hang in there. You are not alone. Hugs.

[DejaVu6]

(((ST))) This is a tough, tough day when we are going through something like this. Try to hang in there. I can’t help but think next year will be so much better and this level of pain and sadness can’t last... not if we don’t let it. XO

[SoTorn]

Thanks everyone!

[ovrrnbw]

I have a quick question. If your W did ask you if you'd be home for dinner, how would you respond?

What does this look like from her perspective? Are you sure you aren't coming off as passive aggressive?

I'm a little worried that the way you are phrasing things is coming off as an attack. Instead of saying "I don't want to hang out with you" why not say "I really wanted some quiet to read this book"? People feel put down by the language you used there. She may deserve it too, but man if you really care about this person, if you really care about yourself, try to think and talk positively all the time. PMA brother!

I see you getting upset at her not cooking. Well, whether or not you care, she is going through some pain too. So don't be hard on her. If she is going to get in a habit of not cooking then you just work on a solution and cook. I don't care if you have to keep frozen pizzas and stuff like that on hand, but just make your house a place where everyone can be comfortable because you are there. Dad is here and things will be just fine, you know what I mean?

WW went nuts and spent way too much on the kids. I feel that she is overcompensating. WW never buys this much stuff. I bought them all two gifts and they know. Kids just told me as long as I am loving them they are loving me and that is all that matters.

Water off a duck's back. Just let her do whatever she's gonna do. Your kids made a great point. Good parenting job, dad! Sometimes wisdom comes from the mouths of babes. So hopefully you were able to enjoy Christmas a little at least.

Good luck ST.

[SoTorn]

I have a quick question. If your W did ask you if you'd be home for dinner, how would you respond?

What does this look like from her perspective? Are you sure you aren't coming off as passive aggressive?

I'm a little worried that the way you are phrasing things is coming off as an attack. Instead of saying "I don't want to hang out with you" why not say "I really wanted some quiet to read this book"? People feel put down by the language you used there. She may deserve it too, but man if you really care about this person, if you really care about yourself, try to think and talk positively all the time. PMA brother!

I see you getting upset at her not cooking. Well, whether or not you care, she is going through some pain too. So don't be hard on her. If she is going to get in a habit of not cooking then you just work on a solution and cook. I don't care if you have to keep frozen pizzas and stuff like that on hand, but just make your house a place where everyone can be comfortable because you are there. Dad is here and things will be just fine, you know what I mean?

WW went nuts and spent way too much on the kids. I feel that she is overcompensating. WW never buys this much stuff. I bought them all two gifts and they know. Kids just told me as long as I am loving them they are loving me and that is all that matters.

Water off a duck's back. Just let her do whatever she's gonna do. Your kids made a great point. Good parenting job, dad! Sometimes wisdom comes from the mouths of babes. So hopefully you were able to enjoy Christmas a little at least.

Good luck ST.

If she asked me if I would be home for dinner and I didn't have plans I would just respond a bit later telling her that I would be home. If I had plans I would tell her that I have plans already and thank her. I really do enjoy her cooking and missed it. WW doesn't just cook for me. The dynamic is that if I am home, all of the kids will come down and eat. If I am not home, nobody will really pay attention to her cooking dinner honestly. I try to direct the kids to be attentive to when she cooks and to make sure and eat but they are really in avoidance mode with her because of how she is acting.

I agree with the phrasing on not wanting to go out with her. Honestly when I responded I told her that I was not trying to be rude, that I just did not feel like going and may go out. She responded with an "k". However, I will work on that. I actually did stay home and read a book.

I am honest when I say I never give her a hard time about cooking. I always make sure that the kids are fed if she isnt cooking. Thats not really a 180, thats just what I got used to when she started withdrawing from the family over her job, EA and then eventually PA. WW stopped doing everything. WW cooking several days per week is different than what she was doing.

WW looked amazing on Christmas. The funny thing is that there was no need for her to dress up. WW went to her moms and thats it, but she dressed up very nice. I noticed, but I didnt say anything. My WW is gorgeous. I wish her inside was as pretty as the outside. It used to be. WW used to be right by my side and would do whatever I wanted when I wanted. Then BAM, OM in the picture and who cares about MR. ugh. This [censored].

I am still debating on moving out. WW is literally in "I have done nothing wrong, I am not cheating because I kicked you to the curb in my mind, I want a D, I don't want you" mode.

[Adam04]

Hey ((ST))

Its been 4 months since BD for me too from August and currently in IHS. It's tough man, very tough. When a text can trigger someone going NC in a physical separation, we have to deal with it face to face on a daily basis.

[censored] that your W is currently in that mode, but many of our spouses are pretty much like that.

Maximus said in my thread that with IHS separation the one with the weaker character loses. You're strong ST, stronger than her so if you do decide to stay and be the rock/the lighthouse, then you do it and don't worry about what mode she is in or what she says today, tomorrow, or the next day. You can show her if you choose to. Whether or not you do decide to move out, we'll understand and this is about you. You deserve to be happy. I personally feel that if you do move out, you'll bounce back bro. Everyone will readjust, you, your kids, her. Who knows what'll happen, and maybe one day you or your kids will have asked what took you so long to do that, but for now, sit on it and let it stir. You can always be a positive influence no matter where you are at or where you lay your head. Take advantage of the time you are still around her to show her how wonderful you are.

[SoTorn]

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I am still sort of conflicted on how much I should interact with WW. Should I be a social roommate now that I'm not so angry? Should I show her that I'm supportive and caring without discussing R? I went near NC because she was being ugly and temp checking like mad. It hurt.

I interact with her but its brief. Shes in that mode mentioned above. Shes in the A still. I'm not talking about being a husband without her being a wife. But should I allow chit chat and open the lines of communication a little bit more than NC?

[sandi2]

I just finished catching up on your sitch. So, let's talk about it. Early in your initial thread, you stated that you had two goals at the time. Here's your quote:

My two goals right now are.

Ensure that my children feel my love and care as much as possible while we are together 100% of the time.
Ensure that I am remaining healthy and happy about who I am.

I think these are good goals to hold your focus on what you can do......and you can do it with or without being M to your WW. Whether or not you are with them 100% of the time should not reflect or measure your love and care for the children or keeping yourself healthy and happy.

I needed to eat so I cooked myself something while WW kept trying to tell me she wasnt having an affair. WW admits she is in a relationship with another man but doesnt consider it an affair because she "left" me.

Let me get this straight. She is currently on OM#2?

Her "explanation" of not considering it an A b/c in her mind she had already left you...….is exactly how a WW thinks. She feeds herself her own b.s. It's how she justifies her choices and behavior.

IMHO, the WW should receive a consistent message from the H she has betrayed, and currently threatens to D. The message should be demonstrated in his actions. It should tell her where he stands with her disrespectful behavior.

Now, let's look at one of the several posts you make about her cooking:

I do like to eat at home and if she wants to cook I will eat honestly. I just said I'm home now. WW said you never answer your texts so theres no point in asking you if you're going to be home.

Yes it's a temp check. However I do like eating.

Is it ok if I tell WW that she can text if I'll be home after work to see if she has to cook?

Sometimes I don't know whether to laugh or cry over things the LBH asks about. For instance, you were being pretty plain spoken with her about not wanting to live with her...….but when she told you she had bought a ticket for a ski trip (I think it was), you weren't sure if you should accept or reject it.

Now keep that situation in mind while I comment on the previous post of whether or not you should tell her it would be okay to text you to see if you would be home after work.....so she would know if she needed to cook. First of all, this particular line of thinking seems in conflict with your other thoughts and efforts where you wanted her to stop bothering you with TM, and to just leave you alone. The part I find a little funny is how often you've spoken about her excellent cooking and how you miss it. Maybe your hunger is pressing you to make exceptions? It also leads me to wonder if her cooking is basically the only labor she contributes to running the home/family life. At any rate, you miss her home cooking, whether or not the kids miss it.

You may wonder where I am going with all of this. It's about consistency. Sure, sometimes there may be something you need to tweak...…...but the message of your actions should be consistent with what you are saying to her. Thus far, you have verbalized a great deal of your message, right? Are your actions matching your words? And are they consistent?

From what I've seen in LBH's, it's the little details that seem to throw them off track. My advice is to know the main message you wish to relay through your actions. You may need to sit and think about it for a bit. For the most part, I think you've handled yourself fairly well. I do want to caution you not to use the boards language as a way of reaching her......or trying to teach her.

So WW invites me to dinner with S11. I declined. So she is sitting upstairs and asks why I wont go to dinner with her that a bite to eat wont hurt. I just responded saying that I just dont want to hang out with her. Which is the truth. I really dont know what else to say without sounding rude. I have zero desire to do anything with someone that is actively betraying me and our family.

If your overall message is "I'm done" or "I'm dumping you b/c you betrayed me", then what actions relay that message? You declined the invitation......which was smart. You told her you didn't want to hang out with her......which was a little harsh for some, but it's certainly consistent with the action. Maybe we can think of some general responses that line up with your main message......and be able to keep it short and simple. I've noticed that some LBH's get very wordy in some of their responses to the WW. It comes off sounding like he's teaching a class!

You already suspect these moves by the WW as being temp checks or some other form of manipulation. Something else some WW's do is try to "normalize" their family activities, etc. She may be cake eating or whatever, but it's usually an act of manipulation. Some LBH's make the mistake of thinking she is "reaching out" or that "she's making baby steps". No, she's not doing either one. As long as there is any other guy in the picture (regardless of what she claims), and as long as she has shown no effort in making amends for her waywardness...…..then the LBH should not jump at her suggestion to eat out or have some other form of family activity together. Why? B/c she can't have the marriage and family.....and other "relationships" that exclude her H. She doesn't get to have the best of both worlds. She has to realize that she is losing something as a result of her bad decisions. As long as she gets to play house & family, she's not going to recognize much loss.

The WW needs to wonder if she's losing her H. That's why she snoops in your things and the bedroom, to see if there is any indication of some other woman. Currently, she doesn't want to be your wife.....but she doesn't want to be replaced, either. (Crazy, I know.) If she believes her H is dumping her, she'll try several things to temp check his emotional attachment to the MR. The H has to be strong enough to walk away from the temptation, if he's going to be consistent in his message/stance. When the little details in life confuse him, he needs to regroup and remember his overall message he's explaining through his actions. What message is his WW getting by watching his actions?

Does any of this make sense? If not, please tell me.

[SoTorn]

Yes it makes sense. The last couple of weeks I have been very consistent. I am very distant from her. I have not explained when I will be home etc. If I am home I will eat dinner when she cooks it. I do enjoy her cooking. I dont know if that's a temp check or not. But I always eat when she cooks and I always sit at the table. She sits by me but we dont talk. I always finish first and leave the table first.

WW has invited me to dinner three times. WW did not invite me to ski. But I didnt make it seem like I wanted to go. WW bought tickets to Aquaman for all of us. I did not go. I am working on softening my words. WW didnt seem annoyed when I said I dont want to hang out with her. She just said "ok".

My overall message is that I'm fine without her, I dont want to hang out with her, I dont want to be BFFs with her. I actually feel a lot better emotionally. The one emotion that has been very strong is anger. I have been doing my best to recognize when I am feeling angry and focus on something else besides the anger.

In all honesty WW is losing me. WW is in my room a lot. One thing I have been doing is making a daily goal sheet. I had one where I had committed to flirting with a good looking woman lol.

I fulfilled the goal and checked it off. I put the goal sheet away in a stack of papers I have. I went home yesterday and the sheet was out and on my dresser. WW digs through every little thing I guess.

I have been GAL like a madman. I have had plans almost every day of the week. I'm either at the gym, out with my kids or meeting new people. I have been out, not on dates, but I would say introductions, with several women. I have been asked out several times now. I am just meeting friends. I make that very clear to these women.

I am trying to grow my social circle with both men and women.

[SoTorn]

Oh and as far as I know she only has one OM. From what I gather she is "in love" with OM, this man who is 20 years her senior. I don't think she has tried to date anyone local. I have the ability to see where she is at all times while in town and "when" I was watching, there was nothing unusual and she was where she said she would be. I have stopped snooping at this time because she is in an active A until she proves otherwise.

WW messaged me this morning about the ski trip saying it was a clusterf**k and that they didnt get to ski that long and it was very expensive but the kids had a good time. I did respond because its about the kids and just said "Glad the kids had fun".

My D19 messaged me and said that WW went up there with them and didn't ski. I guess WW had bought some ski pants that didn't fit her and didn't remember to take her boots so she sat in the lodge by herself the whole time by herself. D19 said they saw her often because the lodge is at the bottom of the hill and WW was just in there by herself. I find that kind of odd. WW took the kids on a ski trip but didnt do anything with them when she was there?

WW was definitely in a bad mood when she got home after the ski trip. In the past when we did family trips I would obviously help quite a bit and I could tell that me not being there made it extremely difficult for her. Oh well. I wouldn't have gone anyway.

I will keep on this same heading. These are the guidelines I am following

Don't get baited into a fight
Don't argue
Don't be mean, condescending or hateful to WW or anyone for that matter
Don't compliment WW
Don't offer assistance to WW
Don't have any deep conversation with WW unless its about finances or kids
Don't text WW
Don't call WW
Don't email WW
Don't respond to or answer calls from WW unless its urgent about children or finances
Don't talk to the children about my MR or WW
Don't talk to WW about R or MR
Be scarce when WW is home
GAL like a madman
Continue the 180 while focusing on the anger portion (soften my words)
Don't make myself readily available to WW
Expand my social circle by meeting new men and women
Always dress sharp
Always have a goal list each day
Always be upbeat and happy around the kids and WW
Respond to WW when she talks to me at home with an upbeat tone but very short responses
Do not initiate any conversation with WW unless I need to ask about the kids or finances
If WW compliments me say "Thank you"
If WW does something for the kids or myself say "Thank you"
Validate Validate Validate

Also, what I meant about being with the kids 100% of the time was that I still live with them and we arent doing the 50% custody thing. I didn't literally mean be with them 100% of the time.

When WW is home I leave them at home in hopes she will interact with them and build her relationship up with them.

When I initially got on this forum my goal was to try and save my MR. My goal has shifted to save myself. My overall goal is to completely detach myself emotionally from my WW so that I no longer have any fears or doubts about myself and about moving on. I can honestly say that I am doing much better emotionally. Especially now that I have been getting attention from other women and making new friends. I havent pursued anyone romantically, but I have been getting a steady stream of attention and compliments from a lot of other women.

I know that I am a good looking man. I have a great job, I make really good money. I am financially stable. I have a good retirement savings. I have a bad a$$ car lol. My credit score is 840, etc. I don't drink, I don't do drugs, I smoke cigars once in a while :-). I know I am a man only a fool would leave. I know there are plenty of other strong and hard working women out there that would appreciate a man like myself.

Thank you all for your help. This forum is invaluable. Sandi, you rock.