another day, another thread, another burned

[burned]

If you saw how assertive and determined these texts were...

I’ll do my best to bounce back. I was preparing myself for this but I didn’t realize it would hit me quite as hard. And I definitely didn’t realize she’d be so...angry? Relentless? Hurried?

I’m re-reading what uRworthy wrote about how they get scared and push harder because they’re doubting themselves. And I’ve read about a lot of people whose Ws got super pushy.

So, everything will be OK, I hope.

[FlySolo]

You will be fine. Times like this use your head and not your heart. Whilst there is truth in what Unworthy's words about how when backed into a corner, they come out fighting even more, now is not the time to focus on that.

Your W has declared her intentions. Her thinking may be flawed and yes, we should believe nothing of what they say and only half of what they do, but right now, your W has said she wants to move forward with the D and you need to start believing her words. It is OK to still hold out hopes for a R. But keep this hope inside your heart and let your head rule your actions. Do not bury it in the sand.

Firstly, apart from a R, what do you want? Be reasonable about what is fair and what is not. Write it down in list form. Put it on the side table and then re-read it again and again. Assets, debts, pensions etc. Know what you are willing to negotiate and what you are not. Take it to a lawyer before showing her. Do not send her anything. Let her start the negotiations (because then you know what you're up against). Secondly, (and yes, I am saying this again) be reasonable. Do not give her more than what you think is fair and do not ask for more than what you think is fair. Chances of any reconciliation will drop if a) you let her walk all over you or b) the D turns nasty. Lastly, limit your communication to email only and only about the D. Emails you can draft and redraft until you get the tone correct. If she sends you a text, reply something like "I will think about it and get back to you" and then reply on email. She still has too much power over you to not throw you into a spin verbally and texts are too easy to send without thinking. Read every text and email multiple times before even thinking about sending a response. Never respond straight away (this is not to play games, but to make sure you don't send reactionary responses).

You will be fine B. Breath. One day at a time.

[burned]

Thanks FS.

It’s mostly the emotional piece that bugs me. The way she is so adamantly pushing me away. I wasn’t such a terrible person that she needs to eliminate me. But apparently there’s a better man out there for her. I don’t think it will ever be me.

To be honest, R is mostly about getting rid of the pain, and not feeling like the last 13 years of my life were a waste in the monotony domain. I don’t know that I’d want to R with someone like the person she became. Part of what has made it so hard for me to let go is knowing that once I really let go, there won’t be any turning back. Not because of her, but because of me. As for her, there won’t be any turning back either, so I suppose it doesn’t make a difference.

As for the logistics, it’s easy. I’ve already seen my L and I have it all laid out. I’ll see what her offer is and my L will review it. I may drop the L bomb (lawyer, not love) at that point. I’d certainly appreciate your ongoing advice, too, because you’re able to see through the manipulation. I still can’t. To me she comes across as pretty reasonable. I don’t think things will turn nasty, but I do worry that she’ll try to walk all over me and I won’t see it for what it is until afterwards. So it’s good to have an outside observer.

And her demands have been reasonable, too. If she’s walking over me, it’s by acting like she’s “doing the right thing” by only asking for “enough to get through school.” It’s almost like she realized the damage she caused and is trying to be honorable about it. I guess I can’t fault her for that. Sure, she did some terrible things but I think she’s now trying to extricate herself from a M that she gave up on a while ago, in the least ugly way possible.

Meanwhile I’ll try to stay busy, reach out to friends here and IRL for support, and keep working at rebuilding the life she inadvertently damaged.

Thoughts?

[FlySolo]

It’s mostly the emotional piece that bugs me. The way she is so adamantly pushing me away. I wasn’t such a terrible person that she needs to eliminate me.

You weren't a terrible person. None of us are terrible people. You are human and flawed like the rest of us but you are not a terrible person. She is pushing you away because it is what she feels she should do. She has done the hard bit now and walked away ... she feels she is on a particular path and there is no turning back. So she moves forward solely focused on the destination. This is not about you, or loving or not loving you. It is about her moving forward and not taking a moment to look up and breath because if she does, she might lose her courage.

To be honest, R is mostly about getting rid of the pain, and not feeling like the last 13 years of my life were a waste in the monotony domain.

You are right. For you R is about getting rid of the pain. Ask yourself this, do you really think that R will remove your pain? You are both so focused on the destination (D or R) that you forget to look up and ask yourself if it is what you really truly want. Unfortunately, you can't make her ask herself that question ...

I don’t know that I’d want to R with someone like the person she became.

This is the answer to my question above. She might yet surprise you in the future. But do not put your life on hold for 'might'. Go out and live your life.

Part of what has made it so hard for me to let go is knowing that once I really let go, there won’t be any turning back. Not because of her, but because of me.

You cannot decide to let go. It will just happen.

Whilst your pondering whether your reasons for not letting go, then you have not let go. Don't beat yourself up about this. It will happen when it happens. In the meantime my advice above stands (I think). Go live your life.

The past 13 years of your life have not been a waste. There were good times otherwise it would not have lasted 13 years. There was love otherwise you would not have gotten married in the first place. None of it was wasted. Even the bad times. Remember our life is a journey a long road punctuated by memories, both good and bad, who make us who we are. Look back and take a balanced view of your marriage. Good and bad.

As for the logistics, it’s easy. I’ve already seen my L and I have it all laid out. I’ll see what her offer is and my L will review it. I may drop the L bomb (lawyer, not love) at that point. I’d certainly appreciate your ongoing advice, too, because you’re able to see through the manipulation. I still can’t.

You are getting better. Also, it is much easier to be objective about someone else's sitch then our own.

To me she comes across as pretty reasonable ... And her demands have been reasonable, too.If she’s walking over me, it’s by acting like she’s “doing the right thing” by only asking for “enough to get through school.” It’s almost like she realized the damage she caused and is trying to be honorable about it. I guess I can’t fault her for that. Sure, she did some terrible things but I think she’s now trying to extricate herself from a M that she gave up on a while ago, in the least ugly way possible.

This is a much more emotionally mature B then I've read before. You are detaching with love.

[TJT]

Part of what has made it so hard for me to let go is knowing that once I really let go, there won’t be any turning back. Not because of her, but because of me.

I said this EXACT thing to my H before he moved out. I wrote something on my phone and went upstairs to read it to him, and I said that I'm afraid because I know truly letting him go will mean giving up, and I don't want to do that.

However, FS hit the nail on the head:

You cannot decide to let go. It will just happen.

This is why WE are so dangerous. What our spouses are doing - much of it is by "choice" driven by flawed thinking. When that thinking "clears up" they may come back to us and as FS said, they may surprise us. But if they wait too long to get their own personal development cards in place to realize this, and we have then let go... good luck to them. Maybe there will be part of us willing to entertain it but the natural process of removing them from our psyche will have occurred and we will have to choose them back. Obviously we've chosen them many times before but we will be in a different place then. So, yeah.

If she’s walking over me, it’s by acting like she’s “doing the right thing” by only asking for “enough to get through school.” It’s almost like she realized the damage she caused and is trying to be honorable about it.

I don't know enough about y'all's assets to know what would be fair and what wouldn't be. I could believe what you're saying about how she's addressing it, as my H has been the same way.

That being said, there are still things I haven't asked for that I really wish I would have, like for him to help more in figuring out a situation with the house - either agreeing to sell or continuing to help with the payment if I was going to be stuck here on my own. Sure, I CAN afford it on my own, but it puts me paycheck to paycheck (on an above-average salary) so I'm not able to save for emergencies or have much personal spending money after other bills, food, etc.

So I'm just saying - even if she's being "reasonable", just check yourself if it's actually EQUITABLE to you. Like, to me, why is "enough to get through school" an essential expense? It's unfortunate if she can't afford that without two incomes, but your income is getting split in half, too, and I'm sure there are things you will need, too. I mean if she would legally be entitled to MORE and she is asking for less with that as the benchmark, then cool. But that's definitely something to talk with your L about, because you don't have to be mean or aggressive about anything to still level set on what's reasonable and what's not.

In any case, agree with FS that considering how upsetting all of this is, I think your reaction right now is great. You are controlling yourself and that's all you can do.

[Joe2017]

Just now catching up!

OK so regarding the talk about the WS wanting recon later. I'd say it's probably true that it will cross their mind several times. Whether or not they are capable or willing to try for recon are the factors involved. I mean, who hasn't regretted breaking up with a BF/GF before? It's pretty common. The difference is the waywarding. They will justify their wayward ways no matter what as long as they are in the fog.

Recently XW told me that she knew she made a mistake early on but she felt like she was past the point of return, she couldn't think straight during that time, and she justified everything to herself. She told her self that she was doing me a favor by ending our MR. She convinced herself to hate me for no reason.

She didn't seriously realize what she gave up until more than a year later. These things take time.

[burned]

So THAT’s what Tinder is like. Yikes.

[TJT]

Recently XW told me that she knew she made a mistake early on but she felt like she was past the point of return, she couldn't think straight during that time, and she justified everything to herself. She told her self that she was doing me a favor by ending our MR. She convinced herself to hate me for no reason.

Terrified of this and those who never realize that they can make things better, for themselves AND others around them, by acknowledging their mistakes and making it right.

That's another thing I told my H when he kept saying I deserve better and he's cause damage and hurt - that the worst part is he could FIX it but he's choosing not to (and this is why part of me wonders if he really feels that way or if that was just an excuse).

So THAT’s what Tinder is like. Yikes.

Oh, boy. Burned did you do some new year experimentation?? I am not touching those apps!!

[Joe2017]

TJT:
Yes, it's the truth: you do deserve more. But what he is saying is 100% an excuse and a cop out.

You said it yourself. At any time he could decide to be a man, own his massive fckup, and go crawl back to you. But he isn't ready. He is making excuses for being a WH and having fun with OW.

Burned:
Stay away from the dating scene!!! You won't be doing yourself any favors.

[burned]

Not sure what else to do. Been separated for 6 months. No temp checks in the past 2 months. Dead set on D. This ish is over and done.

Gotta move on.