Hey P - it's been a while and I've just caught up.
I agree with others. It doesn't matter what label we put on our S leaving - it is what it is and we just need to deal with it. I do think (and I am no expert) that there is a difference between a WW and a WAW but only in that one needed an affair to finally give them the courage to leave and the other, well, they drew strength from something else and now that they have it, they are not likely to back down. I feel (with no evidence whatsoever) that a WW is more likely to hit rock bottom first as they needed the affair to give them the strength to leave - if/when the affair ends then the crutch is gone.
However, in both cases, the spouse was fundamentally unhappy in the R.
I wanted to pipe in on the how long does it take to become fully detached. I don't think there is a universal timeline. It depends on how much contact you have, your own and their personality traits, and how intertwined your emotional well beings are. And of course, children. I will say that if you are still asking then you are not detached. You will know that you are detached when it no longer matters to you whether you are detached or not.
I agree with you on the WW vs WAW. My WW essentially kickstarted the A (today has been exactly one year since BD) and just got deeper into it since.
I need to keep reminding myself to face my fears and continue to detach. I don't know why I'm struggling. Anxiety of losing too much maybe? We were very deep in love until two years ago when I got the warning from WW. She begged me for help because of her love for me. I ignored it. We're back under one roof (for now). I'm working hard on reducing contact with WW as much as possible and I am getting a lot more temp checks from her. Just this morning, she asked me to sub for her class because she wasn't feeling well. I declined.
Detaching timeframes are hugely variable. I can tell you that when I first started posting here I was desperately trying to figure out how to save my M. However since the whole forum beat me upside the head with 2x4s for a few months and I actually got my ass in gear and detached, GAL and 180 the holy hell out of it, I feel way different.
I can honestly say that even though I have had thoughts of sadness and resentment lately that they are fleeting thoughts that pass very quickly. The more i get out and meet people and see that there is a whole world of people, both men and women that are interested in knowing me and actually react positively to me and the changes I have made, the more I become to appreciate that I am my own person and on my own path.
I am seriously considering moving out now. Like for real I think I may go ahead and have a custody agreement drafted so I can get out of the house. I can reach my full potential while living IHS with WW. I am young and I have zero desire spending the last years of my 30s holding a candle to WW and not moving forward.
We should have a BS yearly meetup. No joke, like let's all pick a spot to meet up in the USA and do it. Or even go overseas.
M:16 T:21 H(me) 38 WW: 38 S11 D16 D19 Red Flags of A: March 2018 ILYBNILWY: August 4, 2018 Moved out of MBR: September 24, 2018 BD/Confirmation of A: October 31, 2018 D Filed: March 27, 2019
So my WW came home and she talked about the bill. I took Joe's advice and said "Not my bill". Well, that hit her hard. And she cried. And she asked why I was an [censored] to her. The unresponsive calls and texts, the way I talk about bills, and the fact that she dreads coming home when I am home because I am angry/moody/vindictive.
All valid points.
She told me about my behaviors the last six years and how I treated her when she was pregnant, and afterwards. Basically, I owned up to it.
She has also dropped hints that I was the one who said the marriage was over, how else should I take what she has done up to that point? She told me that I said that I did not care about her first date, giving off the impression that I moved on, when I clearly was not.
Our plan now is to get our debt paid off. WW will be looking for a place of her own soon. We'll see where we are at in the next six months.
I did not dare tell her anything regarding R. At all. AFAIK, that is not an option anymore (to her).
She feels like she has been supportive of all my improvement efforts and has acknowledged the change. She says she tried to be there for me and I keep putting up a wall between her and I.
I validated all of her points, and agreed that yes, I was an [censored] to her for so long. And I regret it.
Finally, I told her that I forgave her. I cannot continue to be vindictive and angry anymore. There is a way to lovingly detach.
I have no idea where go. I am trying to accept that a D is not an "if" but a "when". But I'd be lying if said I want it to happen. I don't. I really don't. And I'm wondering if I have caused more damage in the last couple of months then heal. Because WW sure feels like I hurt her.
You are not causing problems. She is temp checking the holy sh*t out of you man. That's stuff my WW was saying besides being supportive.
Your M is already damaged to the point she considered it over. You cant break something that is non existent. Stop worrying about how she feels. As long as you're not being vindictive or actually mistreating her there is nothing else to do.
What have you done lately for yourself?
M:16 T:21 H(me) 38 WW: 38 S11 D16 D19 Red Flags of A: March 2018 ILYBNILWY: August 4, 2018 Moved out of MBR: September 24, 2018 BD/Confirmation of A: October 31, 2018 D Filed: March 27, 2019
Just continue to lift, try to eat healthy, and sleep when I can.
I don’t know why I’m struggling to GAL.
Her words last night cut through me. She made a lot of valid points about my role in this. I’m trying to move forward, but the weight of this keeps bringing me down. I looked at the missed opportunities to fix this and to be honest, I could not see them. At all. Maybe because for the first 7 months I was doing everything wrong.
By the time I started to work on turning it around, her R with OM took root. But I had to let her go and make her go on journey. I felt like it was the right thing to do.
It’s been one year exactly today since BD. I’m in a better place personally, but I am still, as a whole, a broken person being pieced very slowly. And it hurts.
I feel (with no evidence whatsoever) that a WW is more likely to hit rock bottom first as they needed the affair to give them the strength to leave - if/when the affair ends then the crutch is gone.
I really think they don't need the affair to end to hit "rock bottom", they need the LBS to leave. Once the LBS leaves, they have no one to blame but themselves for picking a POS OM/OW.
Originally Posted by Phoenix9
She says she tried to be there for me and I keep putting up a wall between her and I.
Maybe you should have 2x4'd her and said oh is that why you got your little boyfriend, for me? I mean seriously, she's in lala land. Not that you can force her out of lala land but you don't really want her living and thinking that way around you.
You also said "Our plan now is to get our debt paid off". Why is this is a joint plan?
Originally Posted by Phoenix9
And I'm wondering if I have caused more damage in the last couple of months then heal. Because WW sure feels like I hurt her.
The quicker you get strong, stick to your boundaries, and stop letting her eat cake the quicker the damage will stop. I mean this because the IHS is eating you up. The OM is eating you up. You care so much and she doesn't mind hurting you bc she knows she can get away with it. If she doesn't want to move out, I'd consider moving out if I was you. I like the way Davide did that bc it was best for him.
All this stuff has just been building up inside of you, and you're understandably a little bitter and angry with her. When you truly get away from her, you can get better at letter go of those feelings. I just feel like you're stuck. And believe me, this is not a holier than thou assessment, I'm stuck too. It's facing our fears and letting go of the imaginary control we think we have that is hard to do.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Yes you are dwelling on the past. I understand. I wish I could time warp to five years ago, beat the crap out of my old self and make sure that we went to MC before all of this even took hold. Coulda woulda shoulda. Past is the past! Stop dwelling on it.
It takes two to tango. Yes I read that same thread where your WW got the courage to ask you to go to MC and you shut her down. No matter whether that's true or not, her finding a lover while she is still married instead of again asking you for help fixing the M or putting her big girl past ties on and actually leaving you before she found a lover, would have been the mature choices that she could have made.
She decided to say "f**k everyone else's feelings, only I matter"
What I'm getting at is that your WW, just like mine, made the hateful and disgusting decision to start another relationship before ending the current one. That's 100% on them and not on us. You have no idea if anything you did differently would have avoided that. Stop dwelling on it and just be the man that you want to be now.
You are just bringing yourself down. There is a reason the windshield in a car is much larger than the rear view mirror. Because what's in front of us is more important than what's behind us
M:16 T:21 H(me) 38 WW: 38 S11 D16 D19 Red Flags of A: March 2018 ILYBNILWY: August 4, 2018 Moved out of MBR: September 24, 2018 BD/Confirmation of A: October 31, 2018 D Filed: March 27, 2019
You also said "Our plan now is to get our debt paid off". Why is this is a joint plan?
I would not only be liable for half of the debt that was accrued in our marriage, but since I make much more than WW I would be looking at paying alimony/child support.
Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
The quicker you get strong, stick to your boundaries, and stop letting her eat cake the quicker the damage will stop. I mean this because the IHS is eating you up. The OM is eating you up. You care so much and she doesn't mind hurting you bc she knows she can get away with it. If she doesn't want to move out, I'd consider moving out if I was you. I like the way Davide did that bc it was best for him.
It's destroying me. And I cannot afford another place right now. WW told me she is going to start looking for a place to move out. She also knows that an IHS is doing nothing but causing damage. Old me would try to bargain with her and come to some sort of compromise. I said no such thing this time.
Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
All this stuff has just been building up inside of you, and you're understandably a little bitter and angry with her. When you truly get away from her, you can get better at letter go of those feelings. I just feel like you're stuck. And believe me, this is not a holier than thou assessment, I'm stuck too. It's facing our fears and letting go of the imaginary control we think we have that is hard to do.
Originally Posted by SoTorn
You are just bringing yourself down. There is a reason the windshield in a car is much larger than the rear view mirror. Because what's in front of us is more important than what's behind us
I am stuck. I am so afraid of change, but I keep telling myself it's for the best interest of D4. She deserves so much better and she is not getting any of it at all. At this point, sacrifices are going to have to be made. If I am not the best Phoenix, I cannot give my best to D4. I know I have been doing the right things, but I have been coming across as vindictive.
I really need to get out. I'm failing hard at DBing. Detaching, GAL. All failed in these last few days. I need to get going again. WW is hurting me. OM is hurting me. WW and OM progressing in their R is really hurting me. This cycle of pain and obsessing about them needs to stop. I am just really struggling with it. So much.
