I emerge. I rise. I AM Phoenix9. (Phoenix9 DB XII)

[sandi2]

I keep thinking that I can use iMessage's voice text function, but I don't think that really counts (You can record your message and send it over the messaging application. The recipient would hit the "Play" button and they can hear what I recorded.)

What's wrong with the old fashion way?

Also, the chatting has cooled considerably since our date. I don't think it's a lack of interest.

Once you meet & date another woman, and another, you won't put all your focus into just one. You'll feel more confident and can relax and be your best version of Phoenix.

Are you sure this lady is single? Did she say how recently she came out of a relationship?

[Phoenix9]

I keep thinking that I can use iMessage's voice text function, but I don't think that really counts (You can record your message and send it over the messaging application. The recipient would hit the "Play" button and they can hear what I recorded.)

What's wrong with the old fashion way?

I feel like I'm coming on too strong if I go the phone route. But, I'm going to do it anyway. Only way to continue to take chances and be ballsy.

Are you sure this lady is single? Did she say how recently she came out of a relationship?

The last time I talked to her she made it pretty clear she was single. She ended her previous relationship a couple of months before we met. She has communicated to me she is not ready. But I want to keep her interest in me going.

I need to find more GAL stuff. Maybe activities where I can take D5 with as well.

[DonH]

[quote=Phoenix9]I feel like I'm coming on too strong if I go the phone route. But, I'm going to do it anyway. Only way to continue to take chances and be ballsy.[quote]

phoenix FWIW I think you are waaaaaaaaay overthinking things. Making a telephone call is coming on too strong? Or it's being ballsy? How so? The act of making the call most certainly is not, it's what you say, how you say it etc. you seem so busy trying to follow these play books that you are losing yourself. You simply need to relax and be you. Call, low key, hey I'm thinking of going such and such place on Friday, do you want to go along? If not, then not. If she's interested she will suggest an alternate or say something like "I really wish I could go, keep me in mind for next time." Now how you handle this could become too strong but not simply calling and asking.

As others have said you just need more practice. You've got to take this info you've been reading and turn it into being yourself. You can't follow a playbook step by step. These are cockpits that you have to make your own. You seemed to have done that in the moment when you first met her. You were yourself. But then you started over thinking things. Stop that. Just be you. It's not the end of the world if she says no. You e got to start living with that confidence.

[Phoenix9]

I called and left a message asking her out for the days I am available this week.

I don't know why I am so worked up over this. But I am happy that I was able to sound calm, confident, and a little goofy during the call.

I have a journal entry update that I will post later on tonight.

I will update as I get an answer.

[Adam04]

Yo P,

Thought I left a comment but didn’t hit send. Wanted to say briefly that I liked when you went to that group meet up. I think if possible you should go to more of those to stir up the pond, get more numbers and build up your list of contacts.

I’m rooting for you! GL with this lady!

[Phoenix9]

Day 217,

Whoo. I made it through the weekend. The weekend itself consisted mostly of me and D5. It was a mix of staying home and entertaining ourselves, going out to kill time (take pictures), and some daddy-daughter bonding. Was it as exciting as it was the other weekends? No. But there was plenty of time that D5 and I enjoyed, individually and together.

There was also a lot of idle time which caused past events to come up in my thoughts and that led to some pretty emotional moments. There was no bawling, but there were plenty of silent tears. The feelings worsened when I get a notice that WW will be gone in the last weekend in March. Another romantic weekend with OM2? Probably.

I am also saddened that the A with OM2 has turned into a full-blown relationship. Was it to be expected? Yeah. It was. Did I expect it to last this long? Sadly...yes. WW is now fully integrated into OM2's friends and family lives. I keep expecting her to meet OM2's parents (which apparently is happening this summer). How is this possible? This isn't the way these types of relationships go! How is it that just three weeks after we started our trial separation that she can find someone on HER FIRST ATTEMPT and have it go over a year? How/why is she so "lucky"? I know logic plays no part in relationships in general and things just happen to fall into place, but dammit, why is it that she can get away with this? SHE is the one who cheated. SHE is the one who engaged with with OM2. SHE is the one who is getting her many needs fulfilled. SHE is getting the affection she has been missing. SHE is getting the support she apparently has not been getting from me. SHE is seemingly doing everything immorally and IN FRONT OF ME and getting away with it!

Here I am trying to rebuild myself piece by piece ever so slowly and painfully. And now I am in the early stages of my dating journey, and I am already starting to experience the pain of it. Don't get me wrong, I am a much better man than I ever was and improving daily. But I am getting so...frustrated at the lack of intimate skin to skin contact. Massages, mani/pedicures, even my experiences with a "service provider" (I hit a low with that one) is not the same. I counted the days since I last had such contact...423 days and counting.

And yet, I need to keep going. Because I know I will not get what I want if I give up. I just need to keep doing what I am doing and improve upon it. Keep going to Meetups, keep exercising, keep up with the RotG challenges, keep learning about being a good boyfriend/husband, keep being a good father to D5, and keep living a better life. I know the only thing that's guaranteed from my efforts is my improved quality of life. I am very happy at where I am and who I am right now.

But I'd be lying if I said I was feeling whole. I am not. I am missing a vital piece in the form of an intimate human connection. I know that I don't NEED that piece to live a good life. I know that I can't force things to happen and that things will happen at the right time.

I just wish I can have those thoughts 100% of the time. I hate the fact that I still feel needy and impatient.

[Grace21]

Phoenix ----You have very clearly stated so many of the feelings I have been having lately. It doesn't seem fair, does it? They seemingly move on so fast, If I'm honest with myself, the reason my H and HER are on my mind so much is in part that I'm jealous. He has someone to have that intimate contact with. I don't. I miss it so much! We slept in the same bed, spooning every night, for most of our married life, 27 years. The last 9 months he refused to have sex. He didn't want it to "just have it". He wasn't there mentally. But it's not even the sex I miss the most. It is all that skin to skin contact.

I'm jealous he turned me away, and was able to run back to her. Does he really have an intimate connection with her? Does it matter if I know or not? No, it doesn't.

I just wish I can have those thoughts 100% of the time. I hate the fact that I still feel needy and impatient.

If I think about it, my positive thoughts and experiences far outweigh the bad, but those bad SEEM to have way more control over me. I need to remind myself of the 80% that's good, instead of allowing the 20% to consume me.

And wanting those good feelings and intimacy doesn't make you needy. It makes you normal.

[ovrrnbw]

Phoenix,

I know that it's hard for you to see it right now, but you are just overthinking and overanalyzing everything.Be you, talk to women, ask them out. Some say yes some say no and you weed some out too. Keep your other life going, your gym routine, your work, your daughter. Women will be attracted to that.

Your W found this first scumbag she could, it's not like she has some prize.

[sandi2]

This isn't the way these types of relationships go! How is it that just three weeks after we started our trial separation that she can find someone on HER FIRST ATTEMPT and have it go over a year?

IDK how many "relationships" she had before she M you. Counting you, she is on her third man, and two of those were dishonorable. She's on her second OM (that you know about) while being M. Look at what she had to give away to get the OM. Are you really jealous of her dating record? Let me be clear. Her track record cannot be compared to one of honor and integrity. You still have your self respect, dignity, integrity, etc. She doesn't. You're jealous b/c your first attempt at dating did not end in the bedroom? Are you really going to use a cheat as your measuring stick?

How/why is she so "lucky"? I know logic plays no part in relationships in general and things just happen to fall into place, but dammit, why is it that she can get away with this?

Lucky? How do you see her being lucky? That relationship with OM came with a hefty price tag. She was willing to pay it. That's not luck.

Exactly what do you see her getting away with? Be careful, b/c it sounds as if your vindictiveness is trying to rear its ugly head.

Here I am trying to rebuild myself piece by piece ever so slowly and painfully. And now I am in the early stages of my dating journey, and I am already starting to experience the pain of it.

Why are you feeling pain from your first date? You must have had high expectations, if you are feeling pain. I suspect you are causing the pain. You are listening to old tapes in your head.

I counted the days since I last had such contact...423 days and counting.

What is the purpose of counting? It keeps your focus on how long it's been. You begin your posts with how many days it's been since the bomb(?), not sure exactly. My point is.........what's your point of keeping up with how many days you are suffering? Let it go. Let her go. Stop counting! It's like a daily reminder of adding another day to your painful journey. It reminds you to play the old loser tapes in your head.

But I'd be lying if I said I was feeling whole. I am not. I am missing a vital piece in the form of an intimate human connection. I know that I don't NEED that piece to live a good life. I know that I can't force things to happen and that things will happen at the right time.

I'm so sorry you are missing this type of human connection, Phoenix. (((hugs)))

Again, I want to encourage you to not focus on your WW, b/c it messes with your head. You become vindictive and it messes with your heart. I believe you are a good man who has made significant improvements. I encourage you to focus on people who have lived their lives honorably......instead of looking at your wayward W. Sometimes it appears as if the unrighteous prospers, and we question the fairness. There is no fairness in this life. We seem to think there is, but there isn't. If the unrighteous appear to prosper on earth, then remember that this is their only reward. Don't envy the unrighteous.

[Phoenix9]

This isn't the way these types of relationships go! How is it that just three weeks after we started our trial separation that she can find someone on HER FIRST ATTEMPT and have it go over a year?

IDK how many "relationships" she had before she M you. Counting you, she is on her third man, and two of those were dishonorable. She's on her second OM (that you know about) while being M. Look at what she had to give away to get the OM. Are you really jealous of her dating record? Let me be clear. Her track record cannot be compared to one of honor and integrity. You still have your self respect, dignity, integrity, etc. She doesn't. You're jealous b/c your first attempt at dating did not end in the bedroom? Are you really going to use a cheat as your measuring stick?

Lucky? How do you see her being lucky? That relationship with OM came with a hefty price tag. She was willing to pay it. That's not luck.

Exactly what do you see her getting away with? Be careful, b/c it sounds as if your vindictiveness is trying to rear its ugly head.

I do Sandi, and I'm still on the honorable path in my journey. It's just so much more difficult and nothing is guaranteed.
I feel jealous because she is getting what I am lacking. What is it going to look like down the road? I don't know. Statistically a not-so-quite-as-easy life. I just can't help feeling that she cheated and got away with it. That she legitimized her actions. On the outside, no it's all wrong. But to her family, our friends, our social circle it's a true relationship. I feel like they did they "faked it until they made it" to get to that point. I feel like they got away with a robbery.

Life is not fair. I get that. Bad things happen to good people all the time. I have to accept it as a fact of life.

I am not disappointed that the date did not end up with us making out or having sex. Quite the opposite. I was elated at how well things went. I knew going in to the first date that a hug was all I was going to get. And that's ok. It's the way things are done correctly. It's a slow process. Time is an asset. I'm just bummed that factors out of my control can cause it to end as quickly as it started. It's rough but it is a fact of life especially when it comes to love, dating, and relationships.

Here I am trying to rebuild myself piece by piece ever so slowly and painfully. And now I am in the early stages of my dating journey, and I am already starting to experience the pain of it.

Why are you feeling pain from your first date? You must have had high expectations, if you are feeling pain. I suspect you are causing the pain. You are listening to old tapes in your head.

This pain is different. This pain is the pain that comes with dating and courtship. It is to be expected. I am learning that dating is anything but easy and there are many failures that need to be endured before a positive result comes of it. You can liken it to growing pains. I'm just complaining about it here.

It also doesn't help that I have set myself up for expectations. I keep trying to get it out of my head that logic does not apply as much here as it does other aspects of my life. There are a lot of factors why all of a sudden someone cools or loses interest completely. I accept (or least attempting to accept) that none of it was my fault because as far as I am concerned, I did everything right. I just have to employ the no expectations mentality here as well.

Best example, I called to set up a second date last night. I called and left her a message. She is usually responsive by no later than the next morning. So far, nothing. I am not expecting her to call back. She could have a multitude of reasons why she can't get back to me. Whatever they are, I need to accept it and move on one way or the other.

I counted the days since I last had such contact...423 days and counting.

What is the purpose of counting? It keeps your focus on how long it's been. You begin your posts with how many days it's been since the bomb(?), not sure exactly. My point is.........what's your point of keeping up with how many days you are suffering? Let it go. Let her go. Stop counting! It's like a daily reminder of adding another day to your painful journey. It reminds you to play the old loser tapes in your head.

Old habits die hard. And I'm not talking about the day counting thing. I'm talking about making something relatively small a much bigger thing that it is. And I admit that I am doing it to gain sympathy and attention. I am noticing that yes, I do gain some sort of attention (pity), none of it is conducive to my goals and paints me in a weaker light. I need to stop doing that.

I start out my journal entries as days because that is how many days have passed since I started DBing. I was thinking of actually stopping because one, DBing is a lifelong process. And two, because it does not validate much of anything I have done in the last 8 months. I'm stopping going forward.

But I'd be lying if I said I was feeling whole. I am not. I am missing a vital piece in the form of an intimate human connection. I know that I don't NEED that piece to live a good life. I know that I can't force things to happen and that things will happen at the right time.

I'm so sorry you are missing this type of human connection, Phoenix. (((hugs)))

Again, I want to encourage you to not focus on your WW, b/c it messes with your head. You become vindictive and it messes with your heart. I believe you are a good man who has made significant improvements. I encourage you to focus on people who have lived their lives honorably......instead of looking at your wayward W. Sometimes it appears as if the unrighteous prospers, and we question the fairness. There is no fairness in this life. We seem to think there is, but there isn't. If the unrighteous appear to prosper on earth, then remember that this is their only reward. Don't envy the unrighteous.

I'm trying not to. And it's being slowly chipped away. I am better than I was before. And there is a trace of vindictiveness behind my thoughts. But then I remember that I cannot be that person anymore. I cannot be that spiteful, vindictive jerk. I am better than that. I have made steps away from that person. However, there are triggers that flood my thoughts and it just starts to snowball. I'm watching a TV show and the characters engage in sexual activity that I find hot. Then my mind flips to the thought "WW is doing that to OM2 right now" and I lose interest and become hurt again. I think of the look she gave me when she asked me to close the bedroom door behind me and the realization that she was having phone sex with OM2 while I was in the room next to hers. I think of the sexually explicit emails that were sent to OM2 and reel in the thought that they have done and are continuing to do such things. I keep thinking of what she kept saying to me before this all went down. The part that she does not see herself having sex with someone else and that thought makes her cry. The part where she says that she would never do anything to hurt me. The lies. The cover-ups. It's all still there. It's not gone. It will never be completely gone. It will just be managed better as time passes.

I try not to dwell on it and I work on shifting my mindset. It's just taking me longer than usual and I have to wade through the pain to turn it around. It's better now because instead of dwelling on it for many hours, I am on it for an hour to an hour and change then I move on to doing something positive. I keep up with the positive changes I have made and work on making more changes daily. I am working on becoming a man only a fool would leave. That is really my only option.

It's hard to do the right thing. It's even harder to do the right thing and not have any expectations of the desired result.