I Was Jerk (Part 2)

[Gekko]

Thanks for the insight juju. My career involves dealing with lots of contracts, and I am a detail guy to the max. Every possible contingency has to be addressed. Between me and my L we are going to end up with a document that spells out everything we can think of. W's eyes will bug out (or at least roll) but I want it down in writing.

I never in my wildest dreams thought I would be drafting a custody agreement for my kids. It's just crazy. This is real life now. My kids are young so the majority of their childhood will be spent dealing with this shyt.

[Adam04]

But how much is the back and forth going to suck for the kids

The biggest thing that scuks for the kids is forgetting things. They learn to get what is important. They learn to have two things, one at moms and one at dads.

Two of everything is my goal, cost be damned. Probably can't avoid an occasional snafu but won't lack for trying.

Gekko,

You're doing well there. Hang in there. This is my goal too. I built my S11 his pc from scratch a few years back and its time for a newer one. 1 alone could cost upwards of 3k easy. To get 2 of them ugh... then new bikes, new ipads, and consoles... I know it can sound all materialistic and I don't like the sound of it, but we've slowly accumulated those things over time, the different consoles, the bikes, and now it's like we have to double up on some of those.

My kids favor their blankies. Right now they leave them all over, and mostly in W car. I can see this being #1 issue if yours favor something that's easy to leave behind.

My SIL bought a laptop for her son to travel between her xH and her place. The son eventually stopped taking the laptop between places because he would forget something or he'd have to leave it out. They had the weirdest of drop off schedules. Sometimes it would be during dinners we had at restaurants so he would bring bags of his clothes etc...

[JujuB]

Its so hard on the kids, even when they are young. My ex left when son was 4. It actually took my son a week to figure out his father had left, as my ex’s hours were arranged in a way he barely interacted with son (slept late and came home late). My son is now 8 and divorce and being different from his class mates is a prevalent concern for him. His autobiography for his book “x is 8 years old. He likes karate and Pokémon. His parents are divorced”. Or he will say things like, brothers and sisters fight a lot. When people fight they get divorced” or “a really bad thing happened to me. My parents divorced”. I think it’s harder on the older kids though.

I think when you have kids , it’s just so important to put the effort in and make your marriage work. To me the only reasons to end a marriage are if the other person is unfaithful, physically abusive or leading a double life (addiction, financial indifelty). The problem is you can’t work on the marriage unless both people want to. Both people have to be committed to the marriage if not to each other. We all know that love is a choice not a given.

The verbal abuse stuff gets really tricky. It’s corrosive. Have you ever googled why people criticize and why they are negative? They usually are just as negative towards themselves. It’s what they were exposed to growing up. It would take a lot of self reflection and effort for your wife to change. Maybe she will do that for her children.

I was pretty negative myself and made a huge effort to make sure that I did not expose my son to that. I don’t know if my negativity was warranted (my ex was a high functioning secret addict that was leading a double life- I did not know till I got access to financial stuff) or if it was something I had genuine issues with and perhaps the cause of my ex’s issues.

I do recognize how important that validation is to you after my experience with my ex boy friend though. It’s comes on slowly and you feel horrible and depressed and resentful but not sure if it’s you being hypersensitive. My friends all told me, “nope. Not you. He’s way off”

[Gekko]

But how much is the back and forth going to suck for the kids

The biggest thing that scuks for the kids is forgetting things. They learn to get what is important. They learn to have two things, one at moms and one at dads.

Two of everything is my goal, cost be damned. Probably can't avoid an occasional snafu but won't lack for trying.

Gekko,

You're doing well there. Hang in there. This is my goal too. I built my S11 his pc from scratch a few years back and its time for a newer one. 1 alone could cost upwards of 3k easy. To get 2 of them ugh... then new bikes, new ipads, and consoles... I know it can sound all materialistic and I don't like the sound of it, but we've slowly accumulated those things over time, the different consoles, the bikes, and now it's like we have to double up on some of those.

Thanks Adam. I am about to feel your pain in the wallet.

[Gekko]

The verbal abuse stuff gets really tricky. It’s corrosive. Have you ever googled why people criticize and why they are negative? They usually are just as negative towards themselves. It’s what they were exposed to growing up. It would take a lot of self reflection and effort for your wife to change. Maybe she will do that for her children.

Well I doubt it juju but I have learned long ago to never say never. W is a glass half empty person generally, high-strung high-anxiety Type A competitive, never wrong, never apologizes, controlling micro-manager to the hilt. She has a lot to work on.

I'll never forget the day I had just D(4) with me in my car and we were stopped at a red light and she yelled "c'mon, lets' go, what's the hold-up!" My heart sank because she was mimicking my W, who constantly spews that kind of stuff whenever she is driving. I had to calmly explain the light was red and no one could move, and that we never yell about traffic or other drivers. Bad habit for a 4 year old.

So I will have my kids for 50% of the rest of their childhood, away from the W, and be able to impress my values on them and what is/is not healthy behavior. Never going to talk smack about the W, EVER, to them. Just going to lead by example and try to mold the behavior as best I can. It's one of my top purposes in life.

[curtis7]

I think when you have kids , it’s just so important to put the effort in and make your marriage work. To me the only reasons to end a marriage are if the other person is unfaithful, physically abusive or leading a double life (addiction, financial indifelty).

Juju, I couldn’t agree with you more. Kids are the reason that LBS sacrifices happiness in a R and does everything they can to stay in the M. They are the motivating force to put up with all of the crap spewing from the MLC/WW. The LBS sees how devastating D is on young children and it astounds me that W is so selfish that she can’t see the impact.

So I will have my kids for 50% of the rest of their childhood

Gekko, my heart breaks for you. Not haveing the opportunity to be with your kids everyday is the absolute worst part of D in my opinion. It’s reassuring that you plan to make the best of your time with them and hopefully mold them so they never have to experience D in their lives.

[Gekko]

So a recent incident to report....

First, W said that S(7) was peppering her with questions about who decided they wanted the D, and W eventually told him that we both decided on D. I was boiling on the inside when W told me this. I told her that is a lie and that it was the one thing I said not to say to the kids. W got angry and said "what was I supposed to say!". I told her months ago that this was going to be a question she had to answer and she should have one ready that did not name me as part of the decision. That she should have kept deflecting or figured something out and not to mislead .S(7).

I said I was going to have to think about what to do about this betrayal of what we discussed, implying I might talk to S about it. W then became livid, finger in my face, saying not to put the kids in the middle and not to try an pit them against her because she would "win", they would take her side because she is their mother. I was stone faced as she went on her tirade. When she stopped to take a breath I asked "are you done?". She finished up by "warning" me not to say anything.

Honestly this particular issue is one of the most perplexing as far as how to handle and what to say/not say to the kids. I want no ownership of the D decision but I recognize the need to do what's best for the kids. Anyone with thoughts on this, I would love some input, THANK YOU!

[Hurt213]

Hi G,

I am going to give you some input, that is based on my own experience and growth from my journey. I can not nor will I tell you, what I believe is right for you, but I can tell you, what ended up being right for me - hopefully that will be of use to you - I will try to make my self as clear as possible, however english is not my maternal language, and sometimes, I do mess up what I am intending to portray, hopefully you get what I am trying to say.

So basically, I was through a horrible end my relationship - my ex had just returned to her job from maternal leave, and not 3 months later, she is having a PA with her co-worker, whom she then left her, at the time, S1 and D4 for.

I was filled with resentment (I still have a lot of anger boiled up with the fact that 1: my kids will be broken of sorts from this experience, that is devastating to me, and I hold her accountable, and always will. 2. I am missing out on half of my children childhoods, and that is also devastating).

I came from a place of frustration, resentment, anger and simply being completely unable to see, that my life continues, with or without my ex, and because of that, I told her, and held her to the following for a long time: When we were to tell the kids, then they should know, that this was not a mutual decision. That daddy did not want the family to split up.

As time went by, day by day I just let go of a bit of my old self, and I have surrounded myself with people who love me, activities that make me happy, and I appreciate every minute that I get to spend with my kids, on a level that I haven't really thought about earlier, and I most likely do spend more time with them with 100% focus on them, than I did when I had them 100% of the time.

I am at a place in my life today, where we are telling our kids that mommy and daddy are friends, but we are not going to live together anymore, and that they are going to have not one, but two cool bedrooms now. <-- what changed? I grew, I detached, and I realized, that my kids has absolutely no need to know, that mommy wanted out at the age of 2 and 5. There will come a time, when they are grown up individuals with an evolved kognitive understanding of how relations work here in life. When that time comes, they will be able to grasp the truth, and then, only then will they get to know, what happened when they were little. My ex knows, that this day is coming, and she knows that she will have to own up to it, but not now - for now, my 2 and 5 year old angels just need to focus on what interior they want in their fancy new rooms, what dress D5 wants to wear tomorrow, and S2 just need to drive around on his pushbike - basically, they just need to have the best, stressfree childhood, that I and my ex can provide them with - they didn't ask for this (neither did you - but we are the grown ups, we are the ones who take the beatings, so our kids can live in unknowing bliss and in return, we get to see the stars in their eyes whenever they experience something for the first time, because they are innocent, and for as long as humanly possible, that is my quest to keep them innocent, happy and safe).

I hope that makes sense to you.
(hugs)

[Ready2Change]

I like "Clarifying the truth". I am not sure if that is the best choice.

I really like what hurt213 said.

I am sure I have quoted many more opinions in my quote thread. Different ages get different responses.

[Ready2Change]

The point of reading books like "Helping Your Kids Cope With Divorce" is to figure out what actions and behaviors will help your children cope with a trauma that you have no control over.