Midlife wife crisis7

[Wolfman]

Happy Father’s Day to all. Hope you all had a great Father’s Day. I wish I could, but it was ruined by my w and d. It was a tag team against me. First I was suppose to go to the house to pick my kids up at 10 to go to breakfast. At 9 am I get a text from my w (I was still sleeping) that for me to come at 10:30 that the kids were still sleeping. I didn’t wake up till 9:30 when I saw the text I responded, ok. I got ready and headed over at about 10:10. To see if the kids were starting to get dressed and just spend a little more time with them. Since really she had no right to change the time on me. She knew from a couple of days before what the plan was. As I am pulling up my w is pulling out of the driveway. She said what are you doing here, I said I came to make sure the kids were getting ready and spend a little more time with them. She said angirly, I told you to come at 10:30. I said I know I just wanted to spend a little more time with the kids. She said this is one of our problems you don’t listen. I didn’t say this bit not for nothing I told her 10am a few days ago and she said that was fine. She was mad because she was running out to get me a Father’s Day card from the kids and a gift card. So because I caught her getting it for me now she was mad. Later on I saw my d phone and she actually text my d I went over early to catch her going out to get me a gift. How the heck did I know she didn’t have anything for me from the kids?? I guess that is just their way of thinking. Then when I got in the house the kids were up. Yet she had said they were sleeping. Of course lies because of the gift thing. I go to say good morning to my kids my s is great gave me a big hug and said happy Father’s Day. My d of course didn’t say happy Father’s Day but that she was not going to breakfast with me. I said please don’t start. She said I don’t want to go. I said let’s not do this today just get dressed and go. Well this dialogue went back and forth for a little bit I said you are going and that’s it, I went downstairs then. At that time w returned all pissed off. She went upstairs to have the kids sign the card. I can hear my d telling my w she doesn’t want to go. My w tells her she is going and that is it. My w comes downstairs asking me again why did I come so early. I said I wanted to be with the kids. She said I told you they were sleeping. I said but when I got here they were up. Then she says, I told you 10:30 and you didn’t listen. I said I understand but I told you originally 10 and you were ok with that and you changed the time last minute on me. She said typical you just do whatever you want. I said I understand why you are frustrated but it’s Father’s Day and I just wanted to spend a little more time with the kids and make sure they were getting ready. She said again you just do whatever you want. I said I’m sorry you feel that way and walked upstairs to check on the kids. As I start to walk up the stairs my d closes her bedroom door and locks it. I told her to open the door. She said why. I said open the door. She said no. I said you have 3 seconds and if you don’t open the door I am taking your phone. I count to 3 and nothing. I turned the handle so hard I popped the lock and opened the door. I said now give me your phone, she said no, this went back and forth a couple of times. My d goes to my w and said she didn’t do anything wrong. I said really she is being disrespectful and not listening. W said she needs her phone if she needs to contact me. I said ok, I wasn’t done. I wanted the situation to cool off. After about 15 minutes she was finally ready. I said let’s go and give me your phone. She said no. She ran to my w and said daddy is taking my phone. She said why are you taking it? I want her to have it. I said sorry but she is on my time, these are my rules and she is giving me the phone. My w then said to my d give dad the phone. She started to cry that it wasn’t fair. She said if d wants to call her to give her my phone, I said sure if it’s absolutely necessary. We went out to breakfast.

At breakfast my s and d asked if they could have a milkshake. I told my s sure and my d no. For her disrespectful behavior does not get rewarded. Of course she got upset and she asked to call mom. I said not right now it’s not an emergency. I told her because she did not listen to me I certainly don’t have to listen to her. I said I will let you just not right now, you have to wait and be patient. She asked 5 minutes later, I said not yet. My d has been spoiled her whole
life part of the reason for her behaviors. After another 5 minutes I said ok you can call now. Of course to tell my w that I didn’t give her a milkshake. My w had the nerve to get on the phone with me and question why I didn’t get her one. I told her that my d behavior has been horrible and she does not get rewarded for that behavior. She said you are going to give your s one and not your d. I said absolutely he has been great he deserves it. And I said it’s not like I am depriving her of food she can order her breakfast and she is having water. My w said there you go again being vindictive. I said absolutely not, she did not deserve it for how she has been acting all morning. She then said what are you 12 not getting your d a milkshake. I said I will not be disrespected or spoken to this way, I then said this conversation is over and hung up. My Mr. niceguy ways are leaving. I am tired of being nice and getting $h*t on. Like LH has said to take my b*lls back. I will one step at a time.

[IHCLACS]

Have similar comm issues with mine Wolfy. Do yourself a favor. Avoid the drama and the miscommunication by corresponding by email only until things shape up. Its not worth getting yourself, the family and the W all bent out of shape over. Keep a record paper trail of all interactions im case the stress on W mind has her re-write her memory. Its going to happen, and it will always be all your fault.

[AlisonUK]

Wolfman, that sounds really really hard. I've had mornings like that with my kids and it is so difficult to deal with them assertively even when both parents are on the same page, and when they're not, it can feel impossible.

My suggestion is that you say what you mean and stick to it. Not with your kids, but with your wife. You said 'okay' when she asked you to come at 10.30, then you turned up early. In her shoes, I'd have been a bit annoyed too. If you wanted to be there at 10, then it would have been better to say 'I have plans so I'm going to come at 10 as arranged' then just let her deal with her feelings about that. If 10.30 is okay, then turn up at 10.30 as you agreed. I think your wife was trying to do something nice for the kids and help you get the something for Father's Day, and she was annoyed you didn't stick to what was planned. If you'd have turned up when you said you would, then your daughter might still have been disrespectful and difficult, but your wife may have been more likely to tackle it with you.

[IHCLACS]

^^^ Totally understand that Allison. Maybe I read it wrong? But according to Wolfy. He did previously give her a heads up for 10AM and she allegedly agreed to it.

Wolfman: "I said I understand but I told you originally 10 and you were ok with that and you changed the time last minute on me"

[AnotherStander]

Wolfie, your W said to change from 10:00 to 10:30, you agreed to it, then you showed up barely past 10. Honestly when I read that all I could think of was "what in the world was he thinking???" Of course she was angry because she was trying to use that time to run out and grab something for you. Now you are mad because she lied? OF COURSE she lied, she was embarrassed that she hadn't gotten you anything.

Do you hear us say take the moral high road? In this case that would have been waiting and showing up at 10:30, going in and greeting your kids with big hugs and kisses and thanking your W for letting you have some time with them. YOU ARE YOUR OWN WORST ENEMY. Wolfie, you keep sabotaging yourself on this stuff.

Hope you all had a great Father’s Day. I wish I could, but it was ruined by my w and d.

I don't think it was their fault. You were all being crabby-butts to each other. Here's the thing- YOU need to take the moral high road. YOU.

[AnotherStander]

Taking the moral high road:

At that time w returned all pissed off. She went upstairs to have the kids sign the card. I can hear my d telling my w she doesn’t want to go. My w tells her she is going and that is it. My w comes downstairs asking me again why did I come so early. I said...

"I'm sorry, you're right. I should have waited until 10:30. I guess I got a little over-excited to see them, I apologize for messing up your plans. I do appreciate that you're giving me this time with them."

As I start to walk up the stairs my d closes her bedroom door and locks it. I told her...

"Honey it sounds like you are upset, is that how you feel?"

"Yes! I'm mad at you!"

"I'm sorry you're mad at me, can you open the door so we can talk about it?"

LISTEN and VALIDATE. Be mindful that your kids are going through a lot right now. You've got to set aside your hurt and anger and pain to be the BEST DAD POSSIBLE to them. Ask yourself if this is being a really great dad:

She said why. I said open the door. She said no. I said you have 3 seconds and if you don’t open the door I am taking your phone. I count to 3 and nothing. I turned the handle so hard I popped the lock and opened the door. I said now give me your phone, she said no, this went back and forth a couple of times.

You probably scared her, and that's not the place you want to be for her right now. You want to be her rock, her place of safety.

At breakfast my s and d asked if they could have a milkshake. I told my s sure and my d no. For her disrespectful behavior does not get rewarded.

I'd say you were just as disrespectful to her. You're trampling all over her feelings. Just like we say about WAS's, her feelings are very REAL to her whether you AGREE with them or not. LISTEN and VALIDATE.

Of course she got upset and she asked to call mom. I said not right now it’s not an emergency. I told her because she did not listen to me I certainly don’t have to listen to her. I said I will let you just not right now, you have to wait and be patient. She asked 5 minutes later, I said not yet. My d has been spoiled her whole
life part of the reason for her behaviors.

There's a time and place for discipline but that wasn't it. It was father's day and was supposed to be a nice outing for you and the kids. You should have set all that garbage aside and focused on just having fun with them.

She said you are going to give your s one and not your d. I said absolutely he has been great he deserves it. And I said it’s not like I am depriving her of food she can order her breakfast and she is having water. My w said there you go again being vindictive.

Honestly it does sound vindictive.

I said I will not be disrespected or spoken to this way, I then said this conversation is over and hung up. My Mr. niceguy ways are leaving.

I completely disagree, this is EXACTLY the kind of passive/aggressive behavior that the NMMNG book addresses as being a significant factor in NGS.

I know it's tempting to fire off a list of reasons I am wrong and you are right, but don't. Instead, really THINK about this. Put yourself in your daughter's shoes and imagine an angry dad forcing himself into your room, looming over you with anger in his eyes, demanding your phone or else. Imagine yourself in your son's shoes, sitting at breakfast ordering a shake with your sister and your dad glowering at her and refusing one to her while you get one, the guilt you would feel, and the fear that it's only a matter of time before you are on the receiving end of that anger. Put yourself in your W's shoes and imagine your H angrily leaving for breakfast with the kids and YOU get stuck trying to make peace with everyone over the phone, and your H hangs up on you. Then imagine what YOU could have done differently, how YOU could have altered the outcome through YOUR actions.

[sandi2]

Well, you have your hands full with D11. Everyone has their own style of disciplining their children, but IMHO, I don't think you are going to be successful by trying to force something on her when at the family house. I understand the whole thing about wanting her to show respect to you, but as long as her mother is going to team up against you to side with D11, forcing your way into a room and making her hand over her phone......just to turn around and surrendering it back to her, is self defeating. ((hugs))

Here's the thing, D11 is spoiled, and her mother is not working with you to show a united front to the children. D11 has probably heard things she shouldn't have heard, or perhaps told things by her mother she shouldn't have been told. Anyway, like most kids......she's going to act out in some way. I'm not for one minute suggesting you lay down and allow your kids to disrespect you, but when they see their mother doing it.......then they will do it, too.

I can't remember if it was you or someone else that I recommended spending more one on one time with D11. Otherwise, she's just going to see you as someone who is making her life miserable, and every time you come around she gets disciplined/punished. This is especially true if you didn't do much in the way of disciplining before the separation.......and now you've read NMMNG, you start trying to enforce respectful behavior in D11. I've seen this happen IRL when parents waited till the kid was 10-12 yrs old and then try to make them act right, and by then the kid is going to resent the hell out of the parents. I once read where parents need to show an equal balance of love and discipline. Quite a challenge, when the family is falling apart.

She should not need her phone to contact her mother, if she's just going out to breakfast with her dad. But neither do I agree with punishing her for the behavior she displayed by not giving her a milkshake. When I was a kid, just getting a pop once a week was a reward, but kids of the 21st century don't see a milkshake as a reward. I think you just come off looking more like a jerk, who saw his opportunity to get back at D11 for her earlier behavior. I suggest next time, you find something else where you don't reward one child in the face of the one you are taking away the same reward. It causes bad relations between them (more so, D11). Don't get me wrong here, I could write a book about my parenting mistakes, and that's why I am writing to you. Parenting is the hardest job you will ever have!

Anyway, those are just my thoughts, FWIW.

[Wolfman]

I hear what all of you are saying. I agree I should have just shown up at 10:30. I was just so excited to see my kids and wasn’t expecting to “catch” her going out for my gift. I will make sure I agree to certain times.

As far as going into her room and the milkshake. I am sorry but I disagree. We have a rule in the house no closed bedroom doors. I asked her 3 times to open the door. She refused, I am her parent and her not listening is disrespectful. Trying to validate from the other side of the door doesn’t do anything. My d is extremely defiant and if we don’t act with her she will not listen to anything. I have talked to her and validates till I’m blue in the face and it does not change her behavior for me or my w. She is at times disrespectful to my w and my w has to scream at her before she does what she is suppose to do. I teach In a troubled district with gang members and I get more respect from them than from my own d. My students know if I ever raise my voice (which is never) they know I mean business. I just have to look at them and they know the deal. But yet my 12d doesn’t listen to anybody for anything. I’m sorry but the milkshake was a reward and extra. And I said that to my d. That because of her behavior and lack of respect that she did not earn a milkshake.

Meanwhile the day before we had a small birthday party for d. My d calls me that she needs me to put the stairs in the pool. I said I am busy at the moment I will be over in an hour to do it. She calls me 20 minutes later asking where I was when wasn’t I going to do it? I told her nicely I was busy and will be over in 20 minutes. Leaving what I was doing a little sooner. Then when I get there my d asks me to put up the water slide bounce house. I do that, then it was windy some of the decorations blew off, she asked me to fix them, I did. Then I ran out and got the food for the party. Never once did she say thank you. Yet, I tell my d she can’t have a milkshake because she closed the door in my face refused to open the door and giving me a hard time about going out for breakfast. I’m suppose to just stand behind the door and ask her why she is angry. I’m sorry that is not alpha behavior. Giving her a milkshake just because she asks is not alpha behavior. That is being disrespected and then taking advantage of. I know I am going to get attacked on here for this, but at what point do I put my foot down??

Not for nothing when my d has closed the door in my wife’s face my w would slam the door open and scream at her and take her phone away too. My w is a very “strong” women and I don’t mean physically. Anytime I would do that validating to my kids when she is around. She would say, “why are you talking to them like that, yell at them!!” Or she would say, “I have more respect than to let them talk to me like that and do nothing.” In my w’s eyes it looks like I am weak. When I hung up the phone she texted me. That I was being vindictive. Just so you all know my w has done the same thing to my kids. When one misbehaves she gets one one thing and not the other. So she is a hypocrite. I text her back saying I will not be disrespected by her or my d anymore. My w’s response, amen. Look when I first met my w I was the kind of guy who didn’t take crap from anyone. Over the years I bent and gave in. That maybe I started to look weak. I am becoming the man she fell in love with, strong minded no nonsense kind of guy.

When our marriage was good she would always say, “I can’t date some weak minded guy.” Or she would say, “I would
never date a guy I can walk all over.” I became that guy towards the end of my marriage and especially during this whole process. I am not trying to be mean or vindictive, just be a rock that no one will take advantage of anymore or walk all over. My w is a different kind of breed. Very, very head strong she is a teacher and she is known as the “b” of the school because she doesn’t take anything from anyone. So if I wind up getting d I will do from a place of strength not weakness anymore. Again I’m sure a lot of you are going to get on me for this.

Sandi it was me about having one on one time with my d. I have been doing that for 8 months. I take my d out to dinner once a week just her and I, and it has done nothing. At this rate I just want my own home and to be left alone. Something I never would have said 4 or 5 months ago. My w is gone, my d is gone. There is nothing to save so it’s time for me to start saving myself!!

[SteveLW]

My D's behavior was terrible yesterday too. W wanted to take her phone, and she begged. I told her later that her phone would not be left on longer for the summer (shuts off at 10pm) until her attitude, behavior, level of respect and disobedience approves. She was not happy but I at least go her to understand that her consequences are in her hands with her behavior. She doesn't like it (wants to act any way she wants and get whatever she wants).

So anyway, hang in there Wolf. Your D is playing you and your W against each other, Might need to have a chat with your W about it.

[Wolfman]

One other thing. No matter what I do in my wife’s eyes and my daughter, I am the bad guy. If I don’t yell at the kids or discipline them, then I am weak and can be walked all over. Because I use to talk to my kids when they would act up and validate their feelings. You know what happened. My w would say why are you talking to them like that, that does nothing. She would actually say, “if you want to get disrespected by the kids that is your problem.” But then when I yell and discipline them, then I am mean and being vindictive. It’s been said on here before we are the enemy and will always be wrong. I want to be wrong with respect now. I am not saying I will never validate but I think it can’t be used for everything. Honestly, I don’t know if I want to be married to my w. I don’t deserve this kind of treatment. I am a smart, hard working, dedicated guy. All I have ever done was put my family first and work hard to give them everything “they” wanted. Anything my kids asked for and my wife I would work hard to get it for them. And not at the expense of family time or long hours at work. I always tried to make everyone’s life easy, while making my life harder and harder. I just kept enduring more and more. Yet I am the bad guy??! My daughter wants no part of me and my w wants to divorce me. Something is wrong and I absolutely deserve better. Sorry for the ramble but everyone on here needs to understand where I am coming from. I am not dismissing anything you all said. I love the validating technique but I just don’t feel you can do that all the time for the rest of my life.