So.have agreed that I will be returning to town to be able to see the kids.and stated that I would need to stay in the business to obtain evidence of employment if I was to secure temp accommodation. She has agreed that we will continue to work seperately and that I can split time between work studio and home.but all contact from her is exceptionally cold.she has continued to state that she wants as little to do with me as possible and stated how much safer and comfortable she has been in the house without me there.i know it had been awkward when we slept in seperate rooms etc.and with her continuing to go out till 4am etc but I can't believe she considers me a threat unless she is buying into this narrative she is spinning and consolidating with her friends. There seems to be so much hate and coldness at the moment.
I've told myself when I arrive today I will focus on the kids and not raise anything regarding the relationship and at the same time I'm overwhelmed with anxiety feeling almost compelled to try and explain the past depression and acknowledging the impact on the relationship.i know this is the wrong thing to do as I'm positive that as she would probably listen she would also take it as further manipulation.
Would there ever be a time to try and explain myself or do i just leave that for the unknown future.
It's incredibly painful that she has developed this picture of me.
Last edited by job; 10/11/1901:59 PM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
I guess my first question is would a letter acknowledging what i have done and showing remorse be an act of validation or pursuit.
Write the letter for yourself to get things off your chest. Then burn it or throw it out or delete it if electronic. DON'T send it. Yes it is a form of pursuit. No it does no good whatsoever. In fact a lot of WAS's will use it as ammo. "See, he admits everything is his fault, I have it right here in writing." Don't buy into her narrative, this isn't all your fault. Do some soul-searching and use this as a growth opportunity. But also be mindful that she is not blameless. She's the one abandoning the M and kicking you out, that is a pretty cold, heartless act.
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I would struggle to demand I move back into the house at this time without causing trauma to the kids.
It's your choice in the end but we have plenty of LBH's here that we counseled to go back home and they didn't, and then later regretted it. You're doing it to try and appease her, but it never works. When the LBS tries to appease the WAS it just makes them look weak and powerless at a time that they need to be asserting themselves. You never should have left to begin with, once you leave it's tough to go back.
When my XW decided she wanted out I told her it wasn't what I wanted but I wasn't going to stand in her way and that I would respect her decision. Later she asked why she was the one that had to leave. I told her "I stand behind the marriage, the kids and our home, I am not leaving no matter what. If you decide to leave then I will not stop you. I would prefer that you stay and work on the marriage, but if leaving is what you want then so be it. But I am not leaving." That's probably not an exact quote as it's been many years ago, but that's the gist of it. There's a book by James Dobson called "Love Must be Tough" that dovetails well with Michele's books. He refers to this as "opening the cage door". WAS's feel trapped in their life and want out. So the LBS should "open the cage door". That doesn't mean kicking her out or moving out yourself, it just means letting her know that you're not tying her down and she can leave whenever she wants if she wants. But it needs to be her choice to make, and it shouldn't be an easy one. She should feel the discomfort of having to find a new place to live and take care of the kids by herself part of the time.
I returned to town and agreed for me to pick kids up from school.i returned with them to the house and she said she would be going out while I spent time with the kids.kids put to bed and I didn't hear from her so went to bed in spare room.helped pack the kids off and returned to shower.she had been amicable but then started shouting about how she didn't feel safe with me in the house.she is a sexual abuse survivor and stated she had been having extreme traumatic night terrors.and demanded I leave the house again.next breath saying she needed help with the business.i could pick the kids up from school and leave once I'd put them to bed.this went on for two days.each evening she starts sharing with me about upcoming holiday,emotional stuff about family abuse,issues with my parents etc.each time the next day (I suspect after talking to her friends) all the barriers are back up.shes in trauma and wants me out of the business again.demanding to know when I will have a place a job etc.we got on well last night talking about kids and she started a talk about how perhaps my mother was a narcissist.( her mother is)
This morning after arriving to drop kids off I am literally the devil.has accused me of manipulating her into chats because she felt sorry for me.said she's calling me out as being an abusive passive aggressive narcissist and that she wants me completely out of her life again wanting to know nothing about me and at the same time demanding to see my appointments with mental health services as yet again she believes I threatened suicide as a way of controlling her and that our entire relationship has been me psychologically abusing her.
I'm venting, I know I failed and neglected her,have been dependent and emotionally damaging to her at the same time between her own issues with childhood abuse and these friends who she quoted as saying.he's only helping out to manipulate you back despite her starting these chats and me just being responsive and validating. Just ranting to get it off my chest.
I know I need to just detach somehow.any contact results in same outcome.
Just don't know how to do it when truly love somebody.
All advice welcome.
Last edited by job; 10/11/1901:59 PM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
Boy this is a tough one. I've seen situations like yours before and the best thing to do is go as dark as possible because the less you are around her the less venom she can spray at you. You've got to remove yourself from the equation before she'll start to realize that you are not the reason for all of her problems great and small (which is exactly what she thinks right now). The problem is you have a business together (as well as kids) so that means you've got to be around her. What is the nature of the business, did both of you start it together or is it really "her" business and she brought you into it? I'm only asking that because she keeps insisting you get out of it and I'm wondering if there is a basis for that. Also what is the nature of the business, do the two of you have to work very closely together on a daily basis or are you both off doing your own thing?
Yeah I've realised I need to detach somehow.had to go watch the kids last minute tonight as she had forgotten about a parents meeting at the school.
It's a design business and one work at home and one at studio.She started the ltd company but in a totally different field.when we last seperated she pushed for me to leave my career and join her as co director to spend more time together and be around kids more as I was pushing long hours and drinking.jumped at the chance because I had rose tinted reconciliation glasses on.
We started a new business direction and built it together 50/50.at times she was frustrated at need for me to be more active in the business (finding my feet after 20 years in a different field) and as it grew and I took a more active role she is now complaining that I've tried to take control of her business.
We both have different strengths and I never saw it as anything other than a partnership.
Now this evening I've received 6 messages in a row from her trying to arrange how I will help out with the kids over the weekend.
Detaching and going dark is going to be real tricky.
Last edited by job; 10/11/1902:00 PM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
Wife has mentioned several times over the last few weeks that she has said and done things to me that she would never do to anyone else.
I didn't press her and honestly wasn't sure what she had said in the past.she offered no specifics despite being very specific about everything I had ever said and done.
I think I had totally blocked a lot of what she has said.but last night I started remembering the multiple times she had openly compared me in bed to past lovers as part of "honest chats"
I never pulled her up on that stuff.i ate it slilenty and while I had thought I had just let it all go as just words.
It's been that fear of confrontation that fed so much of my passive aggressive behaviour.damaged our relationship and made her lose respect for me.
I feel the need to talk to her about boundaries both past and future so that we can be mire honest and put an end to the resentment and damage probably via email.
If I raise this am I just causing more damage or providing more ammo for her ,Now that she has fully closed to me and put the walls up saying she refuses to have me in the house or talking about us as she believes I am manipulating her?
Last edited by job; 10/11/1902:00 PM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
Yeah I've realised I need to detach somehow.had to go watch the kids last minute tonight as she had forgotten about a parents meeting at the school.
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Now this evening I've received 6 messages in a row from her trying to arrange how I will help out with the kids over the weekend.
I think you said you left the house? And you are still staying away? Are you still staying with friends or have you found a place? You're stuck in the worst kind of limbo right now and you need to do something. You either need to move back home or find a place. Then you need to get a custody agreement/ parenting plan in place. When you do that then you also should establish some boundaries, such as her giving you X days notice if she needs you to watch the kids on one of her days. This will bring an end to a lot of this nonsense where she is yanking you around and will also help you with detachment and GAL.
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It's a design business and one work at home and one at studio.
Based on your description it doesn't sound like she has any right to kick you out on her whim. Obviously something will have to be worked out if you end up divorcing, but that could be way down the road.
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but last night I started remembering the multiple times she had openly compared me in bed to past lovers as part of "honest chats"
Wow this is pretty messed up. Just in general your descriptions of her strike me as her being very controlling and manipulative.
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I feel the need to talk to her about boundaries both past and future so that we can be mire honest and put an end to the resentment and damage probably via email.
Before you send her anything post what you intend to send her here so we can comment on it. Boundaries trip a lot of newer people up. You can't have boundaries without repercussions. Whatever boundaries you place WILL get challenged, and if there's no repercussion then it just ends up making you look weak and powerless. Here are two examples:
1. You tell her your boundary is that you will no longer tolerate her seeing OM. She continues to see OM, laughing at you while doing it.
You didn't set a repercussion for her breaching the boundary and so had no response when she did breach it. Don't set a boundary you can't enforce.
2. You tell her your boundary is you need 24 hours notice before watching the kids for her, or you will not help her out. She calls you desperately asking you to watch them in an hour because she forgot about some random meeting. You tell her "I can't, I have plans. Remember we agreed that you would give me at least 24 hours notice, please respect that."
You set a repercussion and you followed through on it. She might rant and rave and pitch a fit that you didn't drop everything for her, but inside her a bloom of respect has started and she's starting to realize she can't control you anymore.
Boundaries are about protecting yourself, not about making her do something you want her to.
Thanks. It's starting to make sense. I'll post what i was going to email here for any advice.
Has your W ever been to an IC? Just reading through the description of her actions and words, she may be dealing with Borderline Personality Disorder or maybe bi-polar. I have listed the traits of a borderline below according to the DSM-5 of which for an offical diagnosis is 5 of the below symptoms but some people can certainly show borderline traits associated with another personality disorder.
-Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment
-A pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by extremes between idealization and devaluation (also known as "splitting") <you're either all good in their eyes (idealization) or all bad (devaluation)
-Identity disturbance: Markedly or persistently unstable self-image or sense of self
-Impulsive behavior in at least two areas that are potentially self-damaging (e.g., spending, sex, substance abuse, reckless driving, binge eating)
-Recurrent suicidal behavior, gestures, or threats, or self-harming behavior
-Emotional instability in reaction to day-to-day events (e.g., intense episodic sadness, irritability, or anxiety usually lasting a few hours and only rarely more than a few days)
-Chronic feelings of emptiness
-Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger (e.g., frequent displays of temper, constant anger, recurrent physical fights)
-Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociative symptoms
My W is a diagnosed borderline and cycles very rapidly from idealization to devaluation. There is no gray area. You're seen in either white (good/idealization) or black (bad/devaluation)
