Seeing as though Ive had to organise basically everything so far, could you look into it and start organising a court order if we need one?
D, I would suggest telling her that you are willing to cooperate with her if she does the work, but since D is not what you want then she should not be asking you to do the work and you will not do it for her.
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I'm not happy that she's (a) asking me to do this when she wants D, not me, and then (b) ends it with a casual "Hope all is well with you", like she's just asked me to pick up some shopping on my way home from work!
Yes I would say she's trying to be nice in the hopes that you'll do everything for her and make life easy-street. Don't do it!
I did look into it for literally ten minutes (not sure why she couldn't have found this out herself - it's all on the website with the article she sent me, and there's an online live chat feature with people who work there). It is not strictly necessary.
In theory, if both Ss draw something up and sign it, then it can be done without a L, but the crucial thing here is it's done 'on trust'; i.e. it is therefore assumed that neither S will, in decades to come, claim inheritance or other assets etc. We can draw something up ourselves and get it 'approved' by a L at a cost of £300. This makes it legally binding.
We have no kids and have already agreed what we'll do with the house proceeds (50/50) and agreed who gets what in the house (all itemised lists). We have also stipulated that personal accounts and credit card debts in individual names will not be shared. We just have one joint account which will be split 50/50 after all costs have been paid. Am I being too naive here? In the UK we don't seem as litigious as the US.
Originally Posted by AnotherStander
Yes I would say she's trying to be nice in the hopes that you'll do everything for her and make life easy-street. Don't do it!
My thoughts exactly. A cynical part of me believes she is thinking: "well he still massively has NGS and so will do whatever I ask to avoid conflict." Well, I have been battling this as part of my GAL these last 5 months, so I certainly won't be bending over backwards to do everything she asks.
How should I respond?
DRAFT (not sent!): "W
Thanks for this. It doesn't seem too complex. What we have drawn up already can be used, though it is done on trust that neither of us will claim anything from the other in the future. If you want it to be legally binding and have what we've drawn up turned into a court order, then it will cost £300.
I will forward you an email they sent me with information. It sounds like you feel like you have had to do everything. I am happy to cooperate, but as the whole D process is entirely your decision I believe the court order application should not come from me.
[is that too confrontational and aggressive? I can just predict how that's gonna go down!]
Things are going really well for me thanks. Hope you are doing ok too.
[too upbeat and arrogant saying I'm doing really well (I am!)? Is just hoping she's 'doing ok' a bit inconsiderate?]
Regards D"
Last edited by DaB35; 10/29/1912:12 PM.
Me - 36, W - 32 No kids T - 8 yr, M - 3 yr Discovery - 14 May 2019 S - 25 May 2019 & D bomb - 29 July 2019 D & House sale final - Feb 2020
Thanks for this. What we drew up in August can be used; it would be 'on trust' that neither of us would intend to claim anything from the other in the future (e.g. house sale proceeds, inheritance etc.).
If you would prefer it to be legally binding and have what we've drawn up turned into a court order, then it will cost £300. I will forward you an email they sent me with further information.
It sounds like you feel that you have had to organise everything. I am happy to cooperate, but as the D is your decision, with respect I believe a court order application should not come from me.
Things are really good with me thanks. Hope you are doing well too.
D"
Me - 36, W - 32 No kids T - 8 yr, M - 3 yr Discovery - 14 May 2019 S - 25 May 2019 & D bomb - 29 July 2019 D & House sale final - Feb 2020
I'd verify with an L what you're saying about the bindingness of what you're proposing to do. I'm not familiar with 'on trust' as being the phrase used for no future claims to property settlement, at least here in Oz, and we have a very similar legal system to the UK. Check that term with a lawyer please and make sure. Something being 'held on trust' usually means it's an asset being held for both parties pending something else happening ie "property x is held on trust for oth husband and wife pending sale of property x'.
You need to check with your lawyer what document options you have avaialble to make it legally binding. It's either legally binding, or its not. If its only 300 quid, get a lawyer to do it for your own peace of mind. Do that.
Don't ask her if she wants it to be made binding. Do it for your own future security.
Again, speak to a lawyer and get proper advice. Dont get free advice. You get what you pay for, so dont scrimp now. Dont sign anything til you've had personal, tailored advice. See a lawyer who does family law as an area of expertise, in preference to a general practitioner.
"Hey W,
I'm getting legal advice on formalising our property settlement. In the meantime, please have your lawyer prepare a draft of the property settlement orders and other necessary documents to reflect our agreement, and have them send it to my lawyer (insert name and email address or TBA) for us to look at. Please laso have your lawyer prepare the Divorce Application and send a draft as well. Thanks D35"
Dan, I thought you'd finalised your divorce already?
Me: early 40's XW: nearly 50 T: 15 M: 5 BD: Jan 19 S:10 SS: 22 SD: 24
I checked with a divorce specialist. Sorry - my fault, I should have made it clearer. By 'on trust' I meant that it is assumed neither one of us will make a claim for the other's property/assets/inheritance money etc. in decades to come. I.e. if we just draw something up ourselves, we both in essence 'agree' to stick by it. It's not legally binding in this case, it's just assumed we'll both stick to our word.
To make what we've drawn up ourselves legally binding, that's where the £300 comes in. We essentially send a copy of what we've done ourselves to a L, who turns it into a 'financial court order'. Then both of us have to do what it says without question.
Neither of us have involved Ls at all up to this stage - in the UK it's possible to do the whole thing without Ls.
We are not technically finalised yet. The D papers were sent off in August, and it's been read out in court this week - this is the 'decree nisi', which means that court have no reason to argue why we can't get a D. Then the 'decree absolute' needs to happen a few weeks after that (6 weeks I believe?) - this is what officially ends the marriage.
I guess it might be worth paying as you say, for peace of mind...?
Haven't replied to W yet.
How about this?
"W
Thanks for this. What we drew up in August (split of items etc.) can be used "as is", but on the assumption that both of us agree to stick to our word in not claiming anything from the other in the future.
To make it legally binding and have what we've already agreed turned into a court order, it costs £300 plus £50 paid to the court when submitted. It takes a month to do. Below is an email they sent me with info. I'll ask them to contact you.
Things are really good with me thanks. Hope you are doing well too.
D"
I'm worried about 'I'll ask them to contact you' - does that come across as "sure I'll help you out with this?" Or does it say "Here's the info. They'll speak to you first as it's your project." ???
Me - 36, W - 32 No kids T - 8 yr, M - 3 yr Discovery - 14 May 2019 S - 25 May 2019 & D bomb - 29 July 2019 D & House sale final - Feb 2020
Received official notification that our 'decree nisi' has been granted today.
For non-UK people that means that the court has agreed that the marriage has irretrievably broken down due to my 'unreasonable behaivour' and they cannot see a reason why my W and I should not get a D.
Not a good thing to see coming into your email inbox, but there we go.
Now, she has to wait 43 days before applying for a "decree absolute" (which formally ends the marriage). I still agree, it's a bit of paper. A formality. However, I believe W does not see it this way; I believe she feels that's it and there is no chance of R or anything. But then again I know I shouldn't try to mind-read as it is not productive, so I'll stop! What happens in the future happens.
I am still following the mantra of not believing what W does or says. I have not had any chance to validate as much recently with her - we both appear to have gone dark on each other. Well, I've definitely gone dark on her; she is just not contacting me/ignoring me unless absolutely necessary.
I miss her, of course I do, but right now I keep repeating in my head that I am AMOAFWL and have owned my s*** and sorted myself out. I feel better for that, but there's no denying I miss interacting with W now and then; I mainly miss laughing together and our silly in-jokes that meant nothing to anyone else.
I will just continue to GAL and keep up my PMA and maintain my gym routine etc. That is becoming obvious to my friends and family, so it's becoming more natural. It is her loss. Guess when I next see her, I crack out the nice clothes and cologne, and just present myself in the best way possible (but now it feels like doing that isn't forced, it's more natural as I say).
I suppose initially I was a WH, then my wife became WAS and I became LBH...Hmm...
Last edited by DaB35; 10/30/1902:34 PM.
Me - 36, W - 32 No kids T - 8 yr, M - 3 yr Discovery - 14 May 2019 S - 25 May 2019 & D bomb - 29 July 2019 D & House sale final - Feb 2020
just wanted to offer you some support, I know today is tough day. I don't consider porn usage infidelity and I think you're a good guy. I like your PMA and gym progress. I like that you know who and what you are. You've mad good progress in this short time so keep on keeping on!
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
I acknowledge that it wasn't just porn 'usage'. I effectively had an online presence that I 'maintained' to a degree for years. Online accounts, profiles etc. I never gave personal info away or showed my face, but still. I know I crossed the line in messaging people in 2018 and so on. I've left that behind me now and moved forward. As I say, my W is missing out as currently I'm the best version of me ever. I'm pleased with the progress I've made.
Hearing that I'm a good guy, am doing good things and made good progress from someone I've never met is encouraging. If I can get that across just by typing on a forum it must be working in real life!
Last edited by DaB35; 10/30/1903:22 PM.
Me - 36, W - 32 No kids T - 8 yr, M - 3 yr Discovery - 14 May 2019 S - 25 May 2019 & D bomb - 29 July 2019 D & House sale final - Feb 2020
I am of the belief that porn use is infidelity. I go with the definition that says "Anything I wouldn't do with my W standing there watching" is cheating (within logical reasoning obviously). But then that isn't just porn use, that can be a lot of other activities and behaviors as well.
As far as good guy? Of course you are! Good people make bad mistakes. Our mistakes do not define us, how we respond to our mistakes does. For instance, we all slip up in a moment of discomfort and lie. The lie doesn't define us. But if we do not correct it with the person we told later, that does define us.
Keep working on you. D is not a destination....it is a step in the process. Plenty of LBS' have ended up D'd only to have their WAS come back at some point.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Dan, I think your response to her above sounds good. I would also suggest you pursue the option to make it legally binding just to protect yourself in the future.
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We have no kids and have already agreed what we'll do with the house proceeds (50/50) and agreed who gets what in the house (all itemised lists). We have also stipulated that personal accounts and credit card debts in individual names will not be shared. We just have one joint account which will be split 50/50 after all costs have been paid. Am I being too naive here? In the UK we don't seem as litigious as the US.
Not at all, I think we all have a certain amount of paranoia when going through D that we're getting secretly screwed somehow but it sounds like you are both in agreement on all the terms so I don't see an issue. My XW and I agreed on everything, she drafted it up, then in the 11th hour demanded more money in an email that made absolutely no sense at all. I asked her to explain but she just threatened to fight it out in court so I told her "I don't understand why you are requesting this but I trust that you feel it's a fair settlement so I will sign it." The bottom line, no one is "made whole" in divorce. Both parties have to give some thing up. It's a good idea to get advice from a lawyer, but I'm all for avoiding a court battle (unless it's absolutely necessary) because it just fosters bad blood and costs both parties a ton of money.
