I agree with May, she doesn't necessarily need to know as your L can assist you throughout the mediation process and should be able to stay out of any legal drama. If, by some chance, she finds out or he does intervene, you can always respond with an appropriate statement. ie: "w, I do not want this separation or d, however, I do feel the need to protect myself during this process." The vets could definitely come up with something far better, but you get the gist.
((Hugs U)) You're so strong - don't get caught up in the "thoughts"
LBW 32 - me WW 31 T 7 M 4 No Kids 4 dogs
Separated 1y Navigating the mine field and GAL with or without
Actually I am not getting much of that from W. Lately W has been a bit more pleasant but I don't know what that means. Sharing some details about the kids over text, things like that. It is a bit of a cognitive distortion when she is nice to me, as she has also called me abusive and violent within the last 2 months.
U - in my opinion, at least part of what your W is going through is MLC related. It is very similar to part of what my W is going through. All depression-like symptoms - illogical thinking, no (known) OP (although it's best to assume so), withdrawing, looking for the fantasy world, looking for someone to blame for everything etc...
Nothing makes sense in this world. And you did not break her. I know we all assume responsibility for our own part of the MR failures as we should, but this is something she is going through, not you. The more you come to understand this, the better prepared you will be for the rollercoaster, regardless of outcome.
Originally Posted by unchien
Reality:
I need to resolve the financial and custody issues in my situation. But I spend a lot of time problem-solving in my head. Taking a problem-solving approach is not helping. It worsens my anxiety.
I do not need to resolve my MR. If, for instance, we were sharing 50-50 custody, and I was effectively paying an appropriate support payment to my W, I could continue on without feeling pressure....
This is how my mind works... I can never make a decision. Sigh... need to go back and revisit my NGS methinks.
As I've recommended to you before, if you're stuck in a loop, the best way to start making decisions is...to make a decision.
Figure out one small thing that you can do, on your own, for yourself.
I don't know what that could be from reading words on a screen here, U - but i think if you do that you will feel a little better about yourself and stop some of the spinning.
W and I had a text exchange last night that I'm still processing. I'm going to paraphrase a lot below so don't read into the actual wording.
It started with me mentioning that I wanted a plan to start mediation in January, and that I wanted to discuss the personal spending account setup we are using because it is not working. My W asked for examples (for the personal account), and I brought up two, one of which was her having childcare for several extra hours in the evening. She said she actually wanted to talk about maybe having *another* spending allowance for extra childcare so she could do housework, etc.
I responded that if she needed someone to watch the kids for several hours, I am always available for that call (rather than spend money on a nanny). She replied, "Oh I didn't realize you could do 3 hours on a Wednesday afternoon. Do you want to do that instead of Monday dinners with the kids (these are the dinners which break up my 10 days without them)?"
I said, "I'm not signing up to be your after-school care. You know I want more hours with the kids. You have also said you don't want me having more overnights with the kids because you do not like the kids having after-school or extra nanny care. But it seems like you want extra nanny care."
She kept replying she was confused.
She asked what schedule I wanted. I repeated what I asked for 3 weeks ago... 2 extra nights with the kids, every 2 weeks. I also stated that I understood she was confused about agreeing to this, and didn't accept it. So I felt it was her turn to propose a schedule, not me.
Again she said she was confused.
Then things got bad. She said our current schedule is what I wanted 6 months ago when we separated. I said, "No, I was lucky to get any overnights when we separated." She said again she was confused. I said, "I agreed to that schedule because you asked for time and space, things were tense between us, and I wanted to help create that space so we could work on the marriage."
She said "Work on the marriage, like now?"
"No," I said.
Then she started claiming I've been okay with this schedule all along, and it was me who asked for D in September.
And then... she brought up the safety stuff with the kids. She asked for me to have my IC write a letter for next time we go to MC "detailing my progress." She said "We've come so far, but things were really scary." "All these things that happened in June" - including the incident where I showed S7 how to shoot a pellet gun, and apparently she thought I was going to go on a rampage or something. She said that I've made so much progress going to the parenting class (which is something I chose on my own, but she's co-opted as part of this "plan").
I can't really describe how offended I was by the content of the last paragraph. I don't know how to read this other than a big manipulative game.
It's been 6 months. We've gone to the "MC" for 6 months, and all it does is feed this narrative in my W's head. Maybe she's going to take me to court and wave my apology letters in the air as some sort of evidence. Whether or not I continue to go to "MC" she may do that anyways, so why keep going to "MC" trying to soothe her concerns? It could be years. I need to "face that fear" and accept she may take me to court and this may get ugly. I can't fix it by going to MC for years and easing her concerns over the long run.
I had a couple regrettable parenting moments. I've outlined them here. This year has been absolute hell. I went through months questioning if I really was someone with these labels. By taking the accusations seriously, I only fed my W's belief that they were true.
In the process, I learned a lot about emotional abuse, gaslighting, manipulation, control. I truly bought into these allegations for awhile. I went through a deep soul-searching phase. Mix in some CEN with NGS and you get a person who believes another person's reality is completely valid. My problem isn't lack of empathy... my problem was so much empathy that I was not in touch with myself to begin with. I tried so hard to see things her way that I *believed* them for awhile.
I've been allowing it to happen. I've been going to MC knowing full well we aren't working on the MR, but somehow hoping it would result in the "best outcome" for our kids. I need to stop. I know this.
My current plan is:
- Discontinue MC - Contact the L I have on hold later this week, ask rather than pay a retainer to have a 1-hr session to review my options - Continue to be cordial with W. Work out a January parenting schedule. Press for a plan to start mediation in January.
Finally, just wanted to say thank you to everyone who posts on my thread. I read all the replies quickly, but sometimes don't respond. I've been trying to limit my time on the forum to avoid over-thinking my situation.
Sounds like more cognitive dissonance on her part to me. I've seen that many times before which is why I email keeo record of everything or say nothing at all.
Hi Unchien, I believe you're making the right choice to pursue legal action for more custody. Even if she pursues this in court and convinces a judge you're presently a danger to your kids--undermined by her already allowing you overnights--in the USA they will almost certainly give you a clear path to 50/50 custody instead of continuing to play her games with an unknown timeline and outcome. That's what I've seen before. Of course, I defer to your lawyer who knows your local courts better.
I also like your new assessment of yourself--you're TOO empathic.
Some people who have written here and left without a stand, you could sense some anger and manipulation. You come across as an intelligent, reflective, and caring individual who acted desperately a few times. Your wife's account is bizarre, but vilifying you probably makes it easier to step away.
IHC ~ I agree on the cognitive dissonance. I am blown away when I get these window-peeks into what my W is thinking.
U: I'm 18 months after BD, almost a year of limbo, and 368 days from telling the kids we are splitting up. 11 months from moving out. Coming up on anniversary of separation and having first set of holidays with kids on my own terms.
I've gotten though and get through by reading stories here that are similar to mine. I've come so far. I see you in my review mirror. Your situation and mentality and how you process is quite similar to mine. You've done some very different tactical maneuvers and I've watched you make them thinking "Oh crap. He's scr3wed".
I hope you are not... but I registered just now, and may make this the only post on the board I ever make to say THIS to YOU:
"Go dark, lawyer up, and prepare for your wife to lose. Her. Mind."
Expect her to hold you in so little regard that she's going to come after you financially, and for custody. She's being nice to get what she wants and needs, and she only wants more. When you start to ask for what's fair (50/50) she's going to lawyer up and you're going to see a side of her you had no idea existed.
Keep your side of the street clean, and say nothing to her. Believe nothing she says.
Odds are in 6-12 months you'll be facing trial and the only person who thinks what she's doing is reasonable will be her and her lawyer.
Brace yourself for this person to show you new colors from the rainbow. You have NO idea how bad this can get. Well.. you see it. You're preparing for it intellectually. I didn't. Then it came. The nicest, conflict-avoidant, emotionally-stuck spouse in the world just. Doesn't. Care. About. You. Anymore.
Meditate, exercise, and find your joy. But do not give any quarter and let your lawyer bring you what you should have never moved out without in the first place. A custody and financial agreement that was fair. You're not going to negotiate one with her now. In six months the odds get worse. In a year? She'll deserve more and she'll punish you to get it all while you were hoping she'd snap out of it. The person who said she'd be reasonable will go SIDEWAYS.
You can sleep at night for trying it this way. You've handled this with honor and dignity and compassion. But it will get you nowhere from here on out.
CW ~ I caution others here similar to me -- that combo of CEN and NGS can lead us to not just validate our S's feelings but also their REALITY. We come to DB and get very drawn to the validation piece. Maybe if I just empathize *even more*.
I was drawn in. I thought she just needed a little more empathy and then we could start working on things. I was desperate to fix things and work on them, to the point I wrote apology letters completely buying into her point of view. Even today, going back to MC is just giving her "a little more empathy" so maybe we can co-parent more successfully.
I thought, Maybe she is not capable of empathizing with me right now, but it takes someone to kick start things, and I am going to be that person. I will weather the storm, and hopefully she will turn. I will be the lighthouse. I will walk my path.
See how seductive the trap is? That is not DB-ing. That is sitting around passively while nothing changes.
I'm not suggesting I am a victim here. It is my own undoing to a degree. I probably should have said a year ago, "W, things are completely off between us. I know I played a role to get us where we are at. I don't think MC1 is working, but I absolutely want to work together with you to get us back on track. What we are doing is not working for either of us."
I wish I could say I am surprised you did not see this coming, but I have seen you pick and choose feedback that suits your narrative, so it is not surprising. Read back through your thread and you will probably see a lot of feedback that indicated this could happen someday. Sorry for the 2x4 but you need to stop analyzing and start acting if you want your sitch to change.
Originally Posted by unchien
I can't really describe how offended I was by the content of the last paragraph. I don't know how to read this other than a big manipulative game.
"Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me". You have heard people say over and over about how WAW can be manipulative. You should be offended - not at WAW but for allowing yourself to be manipulated. Just my humble opinion...sorry.
Originally Posted by unchien
My problem isn't lack of empathy... my problem was so much empathy that I was not in touch with myself to begin with. I tried so hard to see things her way that I *believed* them for awhile.
Nice try putting a positive spin on it. IMO, this has nothing to do with empathy . You tried hard to see things her way because your NGS led you down a non-confrontational path.
Again, just my opinion but I don't see why your WAW will want to get out of a sitch that is in her favor. Don't you feel like she is 'confused' only about topics that are not favorable to her? Did she seem pretty clear and not confused when she said you were the one who wanted the current schedule when you separated? The path you need to take does not look that unclear for most of us looking at it from the outside. But you are the one who needs to choose your path and more importantly start walking down it.
Sorry if I was harsh, but I have now known you for a while and you need these honest 2x4s. You have come a long way since you first came into this forum. Don't fall back into your old bad habits. Be decisive and avoid analysis paralysis.
