One of the books I read spoke of love and respect. Paraphrasing here, but It is the mans job to love his woman. It is the woman's job to respect her man. Kinda Yin/Yang thing. Respect her, but love her more.
You are in triage. No one thing is going to turn this around. The one thing that has the best chance is taking a hard look at yourself. Decided what you want to change, then change. You do not do this to manipulate your wife into "coming back". You do it because it is the right thing to do.
We have no idea who you are or what has went on between you and your W. There are just repeating patterns of behavior that many of us have lived or observed.
Change your behavior and the way you interact with your W changes the relationship. That still does not mean she will stay married to you. But every little thing you do to make those interactions in alignment with your core values will make you feel better.
Ultimately, this is about you and how you want to live your life. I agree that the MBR is just a tiny drop in this. Do you want out of the marriage? If the answer is no, then you stand for it. If the answer is yes, then the next question is do you want to stay in the house? If the answer is yes, you stay. If the answer is no, then you have to decide if you want to be an active parent. If the answer is yes, you need to come to an agreement with your W. If the answer is no, then find a new place to live. I can keep going but I hope you understand. Same goes for your W. She has to make all of these decisions. She does not need you asking these questions. That is pressure. Love her enough to set her free if she makes these choices.
Forgiveness is critically important through this process. Forgive yourself. Forgive her. Forgive yourself some more. Do this daily if needed.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Thank you guys. It did feel good and I slept the best I had since the bomb. Not perfect sleep but better sleep.
The last day we had R talks was on Saturday. I was still doing the wrong things then but she stated that she was doing the D for the both of us. She had asked me a few weeks ago if the R was a factor in my depression and since it is I answered truthfully. She stated she has been emotionally checked out for months but she did try and connect in December by her words with a small touch at a party and asking to sit next to me at another. I failed to recognize both of these actions.
Since we told the kids I can’t imagine that she will just continue like this for much longer. It’s not in her nature. I’m trying to mentally prepare myself for the next R talk and action to move things along by her.
Hank, I am the LBS, since the BD I have had the MBR to myself while he either sleeps in our vacated D’s Room or the couch when she was home. As much as I would like him back in the MBR, he needs to come in on his own. I did not ask for this BD. Neither did you. We deserve to sleep in our beds. Our BD spouses have chosen to bomb the marriage so they can sleep in the rubble. I have never asked him to leave the room nor have I asked him back. This is his issue. I am GAL and I can only hope we work towards a reconciliation.
Hang in there. We got this.
First, I disagree with the statement, "we did not ask for this BD." If you read what Hack wrote, he freely admitted that he didn't do the work necessary. Yes, he didn't specifically say the words "I want a divorce," but he saw it coming and did not do enough until his spouse had it.
I haven't read your situation, so I'm not going to say that yours is the same. But this idea that a woman wants a divorce when the marriage is 100% perfect is uncommon.
Now people insisted that Hank's wife was going to scream and be mad. Guess what - she wasn't. If she didn't care, why do you think she would give him respect for it? In my situation, if my spouse demanded the bedroom, I'd probably laugh at him. Maybe it's because I respect him so much.
Many LBS, not all, had caused a lot of damage in their marriage by how they treated the spouse before that spouse told them they wanted out. They ignored the spouse, the refused intimacy with the spouse; they were mean to the spouse; they didn't take care of the family, home, their job, or themselves. They took the marriage and the spouse for granted. Some LBS were even given explicit warnings about the marriage, and they ignored them.
You think, after that, an LBS asserting his right to sleep in the bedroom is suddenly going to cause the spouse to say, "Gee, I respect what he did by taking the bedroom?"
People are twisting what I said. I said that it probably won't move the needle. It's possible, but in the grand scheme of things it such a small gesture. It can provide the LBS with some amount of personal respect, some small amount of dignity because it allows them to take one bit of control in a situation where they think they have no control. They actually do have a lot of control.
Now Hank is both early in his situation but has been here before. So he knows that he can get things back on track. He just needs to do the hard work. and it is hard.
Hank, I am the LBS, since the BD I have had the MBR to myself while he either sleeps in our vacated D’s Room or the couch when she was home. As much as I would like him back in the MBR, he needs to come in on his own. I did not ask for this BD. Neither did you. We deserve to sleep in our beds. Our BD spouses have chosen to bomb the marriage so they can sleep in the rubble. I have never asked him to leave the room nor have I asked him back. This is his issue. I am GAL and I can only hope we work towards a reconciliation.
Hang in there. We got this.
First, I disagree with the statement, "we did not ask for this BD." If you read what Hack wrote, he freely admitted that he didn't do the work necessary. Yes, he didn't specifically say the words "I want a divorce," but he saw it coming and did not do enough until his spouse had it.
I haven't read your situation, so I'm not going to say that yours is the same. But this idea that a woman wants a divorce when the marriage is 100% perfect is uncommon.
Now people insisted that Hank's wife was going to scream and be mad. Guess what - she wasn't. If she didn't care, why do you think she would give him respect for it? In my situation, if my spouse demanded the bedroom, I'd probably laugh at him. Maybe it's because I respect him so much.
Many LBS, not all, had caused a lot of damage in their marriage by how they treated the spouse before that spouse told them they wanted out. They ignored the spouse, the refused intimacy with the spouse; they were mean to the spouse; they didn't take care of the family, home, their job, or themselves. They took the marriage and the spouse for granted. Some LBS were even given explicit warnings about the marriage, and they ignored them.
You think, after that, an LBS asserting his right to sleep in the bedroom is suddenly going to cause the spouse to say, "Gee, I respect what he did by taking the bedroom?"
People are twisting what I said. I said that it probably won't move the needle. It's possible, but in the grand scheme of things it such a small gesture. It can provide the LBS with some amount of personal respect, some small amount of dignity because it allows them to take one bit of control in a situation where they think they have no control. They actually do have a lot of control.
Now Hank is both early in his situation but has been here before. So he knows that he can get things back on track. He just needs to do the hard work. and it is hard.
Pretty long post. How is the post on your sitch coming along?
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Yes, I didn’t ask for the BD. I saw signs and not knowing I was dealing with MLC, did not know how to right the train in the tracks. I tried as best I could to fix what I thought I could fix.
So yes, I didn’t ask for the BD. I just didn’t know what I could do to stop it. I now deal with a H who lives in the “living room” it is hard, as I assume your sitch is.
Hank deserves to sleep in his MBR. He may have not followed the repeated pattern to try to stop what was happening, but he’s trying now. It will be his wife’s choice on what happens next. He can at least stay in his bed.
Hank, I am the LBS, since the BD I have had the MBR to myself while he either sleeps in our vacated D’s Room or the couch when she was home. As much as I would like him back in the MBR, he needs to come in on his own. I did not ask for this BD. Neither did you. We deserve to sleep in our beds. Our BD spouses have chosen to bomb the marriage so they can sleep in the rubble. I have never asked him to leave the room nor have I asked him back. This is his issue. I am GAL and I can only hope we work towards a reconciliation.
Hang in there. We got this.
First, I disagree with the statement, "we did not ask for this BD." If you read what Hack wrote, he freely admitted that he didn't do the work necessary. Yes, he didn't specifically say the words "I want a divorce," but he saw it coming and did not do enough until his spouse had it.
I haven't read your situation, so I'm not going to say that yours is the same. But this idea that a woman wants a divorce when the marriage is 100% perfect is uncommon.
Now people insisted that Hank's wife was going to scream and be mad. Guess what - she wasn't. If she didn't care, why do you think she would give him respect for it? In my situation, if my spouse demanded the bedroom, I'd probably laugh at him. Maybe it's because I respect him so much.
Many LBS, not all, had caused a lot of damage in their marriage by how they treated the spouse before that spouse told them they wanted out. They ignored the spouse, the refused intimacy with the spouse; they were mean to the spouse; they didn't take care of the family, home, their job, or themselves. They took the marriage and the spouse for granted. Some LBS were even given explicit warnings about the marriage, and they ignored them.
You think, after that, an LBS asserting his right to sleep in the bedroom is suddenly going to cause the spouse to say, "Gee, I respect what he did by taking the bedroom?"
People are twisting what I said. I said that it probably won't move the needle. It's possible, but in the grand scheme of things it such a small gesture. It can provide the LBS with some amount of personal respect, some small amount of dignity because it allows them to take one bit of control in a situation where they think they have no control. They actually do have a lot of control.
Now Hank is both early in his situation but has been here before. So he knows that he can get things back on track. He just needs to do the hard work. and it is hard.
I want to say thank your for your perspective. I do think we (DB'ers, LBS's) forget a lot of this. It's understandable as the LBS's are in such pain usually.
Your statement is a reminder that the LBS needs to focus on himself or herself. The things you posted are things that are within the control of each of us moving forward. Your statements also reminded me of something BluWave posted a while back stating that most wayward spouses are walkaways first. They're walking because of some bad behaviors that are pushing them away.
I agree that jumping back into the MBR is not going to move the needle much, because as the OP stated, there is clearly lots of other things that caused all this resentment. I also see it as a mental hurdle that for most men gets them to a better place, but doesn't change a whole lot in the woman's eyes at this point. So I'm unconcerned with it mostly.
Hank, hopefully you have thought about my earlier post to you. You need to come to grips with how serious you are about these changes, are they necessary, are you committed... Be frank with yourself. Taking the MBR will make you feel better, but for her it will require a great deal of patience and commitment.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Pretty long post. How is the post on your sitch coming along?
Once I'm off moderation. I will post.
Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
I want to say thank your for your perspective. I do think we (DB'ers, LBS's) forget a lot of this. It's understandable as the LBS's are in such pain usually.
Your statement is a reminder that the LBS needs to focus on himself or herself. The things you posted are things that are within the control of each of us moving forward. Your statements also reminded me of something BluWave posted a while back stating that most wayward spouses are walkaways first. They're walking because of some bad behaviors that are pushing them away.
I agree that jumping back into the MBR is not going to move the needle much, because as the OP stated, there is clearly lots of other things that caused all this resentment. I also see it as a mental hurdle that for most men gets them to a better place, but doesn't change a whole lot in the woman's eyes at this point. So I'm unconcerned with it mostly.
Hank, hopefully you have thought about my earlier post to you. You need to come to grips with how serious you are about these changes, are they necessary, are you committed... Be frank with yourself. Taking the MBR will make you feel better, but for her it will require a great deal of patience and commitment.
Exactly. You know what starts to win respect from your spouse? Owning your stuff and being committed to work on it. And you can't work on your stuff with the idea that you want to win your spouse back. Because if you do get a second chance, there is the possibility the work will stop. You work on your stuff to be a better person, parent, etc. The attitude should be I want to work on XX because I don't want to be that type of person anymore. Not, I want to work on XX because my spouse told me that was a complaint in the marriage.
I have given myself a hard look and I don’t want to be the person I have become. I want these changes to be permanent for my children, so they have a more loving father.
This morning was tense. She was very short with me and seemed to have little patiences with some of the kids.
I have a physiologist appointment tomorrow morning, the first since the R talk, but he knows our situation well. W will ask about the appointment, I usually give her insight as to how they go. Should I continue this or just keep it brief?
You know what starts to win respect from your spouse? Owning your stuff and being committed to work on it. And you can't work on your stuff with the idea that you want to win your spouse back...You work on your stuff to be a better person, parent, etc. The attitude should be I want to work on XX because I don't want to be that type of person anymore. Not, I want to work on XX because my spouse told me that was a complaint in the marriage.
These are wise words.
Hank,
Each of us makes about 32,000 decisions a day. We decide when to wake up, when to get out of bed, should we make the bed, should I shave, should I shower, what shampoo should I use, what clothes the wear..etc
Make choices that align with this(I crossed out one item that you should now do while the R is at this stage):
Originally Posted by Coach
Confidence by and far is the key in being attractive to women. . Women want to feel safe. A man that is confident projects that magnetism. A confident man is busy taking care of his home, career, body, cars, spirit, finances, mind and kids. When a woman sees her man handling his business and taking care of things it's attractive. Women nag when things aren't being taken care of, it's her way of letting you know what is on her mind. The problem is if you are a "nice guy" or pleaser you don't want to burden your wife with your problems because it might upset her. This makes her feel unsettled (not safe) because you are not being honest with her and you are avoiding her feelings. How can she feel safe if you can't stand up to her feelings?
One thing that was a huge 180 for me was how I reacted to my wife's worrying. I used to try and fix it, explain to her why she shouldn't feel that way and then tell her what I would do. (Women do you understand why men have this desire to fix things for you?) So the solution now is to really listen to her, try to understand her POV and then ask a probing open-ended question: "How can I help/support you with that?" It was eye-opening to me to find out alot of times that I wasn't expected to do anything except listen.
How to build confidence- get busy, take action, do something and talk about it.
Physical- strength training (it works wonders on the young men I coach), look good, dress like a man, walk tall, join a team
Mental- keep learning, read, take a class
Emotional - love yourself, know yourself, accept yourself, forgive yourself, let go of fear, be a good partner, become intimate
Spiritual - understand your light and dark sides, challenge your view of God, embrace quiet, pray, be grateful
What else is attractive? Make goals and plans then share them with your spouse (intomesee). Have a sense of humor and know when to use it. Build excitement into your life. Don't be to predictable. Be responsible for yourself. You define your legacy.
When you become responsible for yourself you have the confidence to "set them free." Your happiness and your life is all about you handling it the best for you. When you let someone else dictate how your life will be run then you are a victim and that isn't attractive. The DB techniques are all about doing healthy things for yourself. You are in control of your thoughts, feelings and actions. So when your world is collapsing around you, how attractive is it to be in control and moving forward? That's the calm, assertive energy you want to give off. It's powerful.
You can handle it. Strength and Honor.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
This morning was tense. She was very short with me and seemed to have little patience with some of the kids.
Parenting is hard work. Are you both putting in equal effort? Are you both on the same page as far as parenting styles? Do you step in and help without being asked? This is one of those love and respect things. Your job as the father is to step in and take care of parenting things without her asking.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
