Nope and that comes back to me being a total idiot and letting her come back so easy! I honestly think it’s a waste of time having her phone pin etc as she could easily just be deleting texts etc. She says she wants more independence (which I have never stopped her having) as she has never been an independent person before being that she went from living with parents to being married and having kids, I do get that but it just seems counter intuitive to what’s needed right now to heal the marriage (transparency). She is doing take set by her councillor (going to shops herself etc) and seems to be driven by what she wants to do and I now know how important it was to have boundaries in place before she came back.
Yeah it's a common theme here where the WW says and does the minimum to get back in the house then manipulates their way out of doing the work. These rarely last and the WW either connects back with their AP of finds another. When there is no motivation to do the hard work nothing is typically fixed. You don't have a signature so it's hard to get a good read on your sitch but right now it doesn't sound promising. Remember that words mean nothing and only look at actions.
She spent most of the morning in bed and I made the family and her something to eat. Then she comes down late afternoon gives me a kiss (2pm) says she is going for a drive to her Mums. Its 4 hours later and I have hardly heard a peep out of her. I have hardly seen her all day
I just wanted to chime in-- I completely agree with the others that you need to back off on any and all pressure-inducing behaviors. Give her space and focus on yourself and your kids. What makes you happy? Do that! Stop worrying so much about where your W's head is or isn't. It is completely out of your control. Spend your time focusing on where you do have control-- your own behavior and choices. Only that.
Let me outline a few possible scenarios for you.
One, she is still in contact with AP and cake-eating with the best of them. Telling you she's working on the M but really just stringing you along. She spent all morning texting him and went out to see him this afternoon while you took care of the kids.
Two, she is not in contact with AP anymore and is truly committed to working on the M. However, she is confused and depressed. She is grieving the loss of AP and the fantasy of what that potential future represented to her (freedom, fun, sex, etc.). She is scared that the same problems in your M will resurface. Is this her only chance to break free? Etc. And, she is grappling with the personal demons that led her her cheat in the first place, whether she's still justifying it a "ross and rachel' thing (that cracked me up btw) or is willing to look deeper beyond the justifications. She has work to do on herself that doesn't involve you. She slept in because she's depressed and she went to her mother's house to get some time for herself and/or to talk to her mom.
Three, she is out of touch with AP but she isn't really committed to working on the M. She's taking advantage of your willingness to stand but isn't really interested in understanding what led her to have an A. She's biding her time but has no real motivation to change. She's still depressed about the loss of AP and the fantasy of what it might represent, etc., like in the scenario above. She may or may not still be in some minimal level of contact with AP and is still thinking about him rather than letting him go.
I know we aren't supposed to mindread, and I don't think at this point you can tell which of the above scenarios are true with your W from her actions. There are more possibilities, also, and her mindset may change as you move forward as well-- just because she feels one way today does not mean she'll feel that way in a month or a year. But my question to you is-- are you OK with all of the above? I know you hope it is number two, but what if it is number one? Are you still willing to stand? Or would it be better for your own mental health to separate, if you can't stop obsessing about whether or not she's still cheating?
I think you need to take some time and space to decide what is best for YOU. I mean, even in the best case scenario where she's being 100 percent honest with you, that is exactly what she is doing. Why should you be sitting around just waiting to see what she does, and watching and dissecting her every move like a hawk? My advice-- don't.
Unfortunately, you're in a situation where it very well could be a false reconciliation and your W is still in touch with AP (ask me how I know ) possibly because you took her back too easily, no transparency plan in place, etc. Whatever. You need to decide if you are OK staying in your current situation, not really knowing if any of this is the case. Understanding what actions you are seeing from her and what you aren't. For instance, you say she lacks empathy for what she's done (I'm in the same place with my own H.) Are you OK with that right now? I understand it is super frustrating and unfair. All of this is. You don't deserve any of it. But, unfortunately, it is your reality right now. As Pommy says, even under the best of circumstances where your W is truly committed to reconciling with you, her timeline is very, very different from yours. Marathon not a sprint and all that.
If you truly look at your situation and understand that your W may be continuing to cake eat for all your know and you're still willing to stand for now, I think you're back to the basics of DB-- GAL, 180s, removing all pressure, initiating of sex or affection, R talks, etc. Just focusing on yourself. If you aren't OK with that, then what are you okay with? Do you want to separate for now? If so, what is your best case scenario, for you? What are your boundaries to protect yourself during this difficult time? I think the more you can focus on what you need and want, regardless of your W and what she's doing, the better.
Knowing and enforcing your own boundaries is also critical.
Finally, there is a lot of talk about whether the WS sees you as a person of value or not. I think the most important part of all of this is being sure you see yourself as a person of value. Once you believe this to your core, can stand tall and enforce your boundaries of what behaviors you will or won't accept-- you'll be fine, no matter what.
Hang in there.
Me (46) H (42) M:14 T:18, D9 & D11 4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs 9/20 - present: R and piecing
My wife yesterday disclosed that she has been speaking to a counsellor and she said that she has been talking about all of this along with some past childhood stuff that she’s never dealt with before and it’s been stirring up a lot for her.. She has said she honestly isn’t sure what she wants right now but does want to try working on us but her head is all over the place right now.
I want to chime in and say that I agree with the others. Give her space. Give her time. No pressure on her. Don't initiate anything in the way of R. Don't enable bad behavior but encourage her use of a therapist. Stay positive.
I have a feeling your situation will have a good ending. Just keep to the DB rules for now.
Remember WMWB: ACTIONS speak louder than words. I get very frustrated with LBSs on this forum saying:
"She said this....or she said that......" "He said this, so I know I am right about how he feels....."
WORDS ARE MEANINGLESS. Actions. Your W leave for 4 hours. Did she really go to her Mums? WW's capacity to lie is OFF THE CHART. Even if she did go to Mums, did she stay there for 4 hours? My W when she was a WW would often do what she said she was going to do.....but then do a whole lot more too. "I am going to the grocery store." 2 hours later (the grocery store was 5 minutes from our house), she come back with a three bags of groceries. Because she was engaging her EAP in the parking lot, while she shopped, etc.
ACTIONS. Not words. Her actions to me are clear that she is still a WW. She didn't come back because she wanted to save the marriage. Plan A (OM) fell through, so she landed safe and sound in the safety net of Plan B (you).
So start commanding respect again. You can't control her, but you certainly can control you.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Thanks everyone. I have backed off and I am giving her space.
All of the scenarios that may22 outlined have crossed my mind and of course I'm not a mind reader (wish I was) and honestly at this point I can't tell which of the above scenarios I'm in based on my W actions so far. She does openly admit that she thinks she is going through grieving the R with the OM and she did say she wasn't sure what she wanted and that her head was all over the place and is full of doubts but she does want to try work on us. So I guess right now I just need to take her word for it and go with the flow as they say.
When she leaves for work she gives me an open mouth kiss and then I usually don't hear from her until she is home. Is it pursuing if I drop her a quick text to ask her how her day is going or should I just leave her be?
Strangely enough may22 my wife does seems to see the A as a Ross & Rachel situation as she was "only" texting the guy as "friends" and they "only" became physical when she said we where over and right now (at least not openly) she just doesn't seem to acknowledge the texting action (emotional) lead to the physical. Or acknowledge the pain this has caused me although of course if its true about her coming off the addiction of this A I can understand why that may be the case. Of course it hurts that she walked out of the marriage rather than working on it and decided to replace me with someone else which has left me feeling insecure and has shot my self esteem to pieces (things I am now working on), and then don't get me started on the blame shifting and gas lighting which I honestly think did most of the damage. I too carry guilt for the role I played in allowing my M to get into this state.
It certainly is super frustrating and unfair and it does make me feel angry at times that she wanted to come back and is now backsliding perhaps due to deceit or perhaps due to going through the motions who knows. Sometimes I feel like she is trying to push me away with her actions but then I remind myself I shouldn't assume anything as I don't know what's going on in her head. Plus its just stupid stuff like I ask her how her day was and she doesn't ask me about my day (I know it sounds petty), or that she would rather sit on her phone than maybe watch something together or have a conversation.
I keep reminding myself for now is that at least she is home and with her here that gives the best chance for the situation to improve.
I disagree. Time and space are the only thing that turns these around long term. They have to come home when they are ready to come home and ready to work on the marriage. Anything else is typically a “stay of execution”. While they are not in the marriage everything you do is annoying and magnified 1000% while they are in that mindset.
) possibly because you took her back too easily, no transparency plan in place, etc. Whatever. You need to decide if you are OK staying in your current situation, not really knowing if any of this is the case. Understanding what actions you are seeing from her and what you aren't. For instance, you say she lacks empathy for what she's done (I'm in the same place with my own H.) Are you OK with that right now? I understand it is super frustrating and unfair. All of this is. You don't deserve any of it. But, unfortunately, it is your reality right now. As Pommy says, even under the best of circumstances where your W is truly committed to reconciling with you, her timeline is very, very different from yours. Marathon not a sprint and all that.