Big ups for that one Scott!!! That’s huge! PROGRESS!
Me: 34 Stbxw: 30 D:5 D:3 Mini bd: May/June 2019 Married: Aug 2019 BD: 6th Dec 2019 OM Confirmed: Feb 2020 March 2020: I filed for D Waiting for D to be finalized and W to move out end of January 2021
She has exhibited ZERO behaviors in the last 5 months that would indicate anything different than divorce. And in the last 17 months the reality is she has exhibited ZERO Proactive behaviors that would indicate anything different.
I have not been honest with myself because I couldn’t accept it. She has sent some mixed signals, but in reality it was me trying to read what I wanted into her behaviors. I’ve got to move on.
My only caution here is that there a difference in accepting that she isn't coming back and not wanting to go back to the way things were. Lots of LBSs get to the point where they finally realize that their walkaway is not going to change their mind, but the LBS is still OPEN to that possibility deep down and ready to accept any conditions the WAS puts on it. What I want you to do do is work towards the latter, not WANTING to go back to the way things were. Then if she decides she does want to come back, you are the one that states conditions for that to occur! (MC, IC for her, etc.)
But I agree with the others, great step in stopping yourself from the celebration champagne.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
I'm not willing to accept conditions that she puts on this. Her behavior has not been acceptable. If she comes back she will try to be the one that issues the report card to me, the way it has always been.
"Scott, these are the things that are wrong with you. You need to fix them to earn my love and save our marriage. I'll wait here and watch while you get to work, good luck."
No Beuno! I'm not the only one here who has dealt with this and it is utter BS. Despicable. I'm not doing that again. Not that way. If we were ever to reconcile I will take and hold the steering wheel for a while. She won't like it, and that's why ultimately its not going to work out or happen, which is why I'm moving on.
I'm not willing to accept conditions that she puts on this. Her behavior has not been acceptable. If she comes back she will try to be the one that issues the report card to me, the way it has always been.
"Scott, these are the things that are wrong with you. You need to fix them to earn my love and save our marriage. I'll wait here and watch while you get to work, good luck."
No Beuno! I'm not the only one here who has dealt with this and it is utter BS. Despicable. I'm not doing that again. Not that way. If we were ever to reconcile I will take and hold the steering wheel for a while. She won't like it, and that's why ultimately its not going to work out or happen, which is why I'm moving on.
Good! Cement this. So many LBSs want to take a hardline with the WAS, but waffle the minute the WAS hints they are willing to try. Make sure she REALLY wants to come back by being the one with conditions.
You've got this, Scott. Keep growing.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
After I said I went to Florida she sent me an email asking why I “violated” our agreement not to travel. I said that I didn’t And asked her to read the agreement our mediator put together. Then she comes over to drop something off for our daughter. I let her greet the kids and then Waited outside.
Once the kids were gone I said we should talk about the travel. She said nope. I said if you read the agreement... and she started running to her car. I told her that I was no longer going to accept the way she treats me as she slammed her door and drove off.
Then she got home and sent me four emails. One saying she read our agreement and that I was wrong, that we had committed not to travel. (This was not true and immediately sent it to an attorney friend of mine to confirm I wasn’t crazy - she read it and confirmed my thinking). She sent me another email about kids sports (which I had already sent her the schedule for earlier in the day). Another one telling me to call my neighbor because he owes my son money for chores. And another saying she signed up for some family software to manage our calendar, which had been written into our “agreement”.
Holy smokes. It almost ruined my first night with the kids in five days; I was really on tilt.
But, I’m glad I stood my ground and stuck up for myself. This was not a time to listen and validate or to be a patsy. She needs to stop trying to control me and push me around. She used to do this all the time, she would say I agreed to something that I never agreed to and then claim I was changing the truth; this time it’s literally in writing and she STILL claims I’m changing the story. It’s crazy. I remember clearly going over our arrangement with the mediator and the mediator telling her she couldn’t control me and that I could make my own decisions.
Maybe somewhere here would say I should have handled something differently. Maybe i should not have replied to her email that accused me of “violations.” My reply was short and direct. Maybe when she stopped by i should not have said anything to her at all. But at some point, I can’t stand by and allow this behavior to continue. I’m getting divorced and I can’t let her beat on me anymore. That’s got to end.
I agree Scott should not allow his STBXW to tell him what to do. Maybe the anger helps with that. I would consider calming down before you interact for your sanity and the co-parenting relationship.
Originally Posted by ScottB
After I said I went to Florida she sent me an email asking why I “violated” our agreement not to travel.
I'd probably reply, "Oh, what section of our agreement do you believe my travel violated?" Unless a matter is urgent, I only reply to my ex on my kid-free days, so as not to eat into time with my kids.
Originally Posted by Scott
Once the kids were gone I said we should talk about the travel. She said nope. I said if you read the agreement... and she started running to her car.
You did not accept "No" for an answer. That doesn't sound good and could escalate.
Originally Posted by Scott
I told her that I was no longer going to accept the way she treats me as she slammed her door and drove off. I can’t stand by and allow this behavior to continue.
I'm baffled by what you mean. She's free to make claims you violate the agreement or say "No" to a conversation with you anytime she wants. You control whether you engage or get riled up.
Originally Posted by Scott
One saying she read our agreement and that I was wrong, that we had committed not to travel. (This was not true and immediately sent it to an attorney friend of mine to confirm I wasn’t crazy - she read it and confirmed my thinking).
If she goes to court, it sounds like you are confident in your agreement and state travel guidelines.
I'm a big fan of the progress you have made. This is how I interpret your interactions with your STBXW--
If Steve goes on the trip: : This is Steve being in-control and Steve standing up for himself
If Steve cancels his trip because it's risky, breaks his agreement, or breaks state rules: : This is Steve being prudent
If Steve cancels a trip because his wife says so: : This is Steve's wife being in control and Steve not standing up for himself
If Steve ignores or responds briefly to his STBXW's e-mail: : This is Steve detaching
If Steve gets riles up, argues who's right, won't stop after "No", and believes his STBXW must change: : This is Steve NOT detaching
Originally Posted by Scott
I can’t stand by and allow this behavior to continue. I’m getting divorced and I can’t let her beat on me anymore.
She's most in control when you allow her to drive your choices, somewhat in control when you allow her to drive your words and feelings (where you are now), and least in control when you detach and let go.
She used to do this all the time, she would say I agreed to something that I never agreed to and then claim I was changing the truth; this time it’s literally in writing and she STILL claims I’m changing the story. It’s crazy. I remember clearly going over our arrangement with the mediator and the mediator telling her she couldn’t control me and that I could make my own decisions.
Scott,
Google gas lighting.
Classic Narc trait.
I believed i was going crazy when my WW was gaslighting me. I resorted to always carrying an old iphone in my pocket recording. After a few days of listening to our conversations, i realised i wasn't going crazy - she was telling me one thing, to change it days later and make out like i was wrong or crazy.
My ex still does this - hence i insist on all child correspondance in writing.. Ironically, she still does it on email..
keep it all to emails - do not engage in verbal converation.. You may leave with your head spinning.
Previous username - Helpme123.. A name chosen at a desperate time..
Now Mr Brightside.. coming out of my cage, and doing just fine.
After I said I went to Florida she sent me an email asking why I “violated” our agreement not to travel. I said that I didn’t And asked her to read the agreement our mediator put together. Then she comes over to drop something off for our daughter. I let her greet the kids and then Waited outside.
Once the kids were gone I said we should talk about the travel. She said nope. I said if you read the agreement... and she started running to her car. I told her that I was no longer going to accept the way she treats me as she slammed her door and drove off.
Then she got home and sent me four emails. One saying she read our agreement and that I was wrong, that we had committed not to travel. (This was not true and immediately sent it to an attorney friend of mine to confirm I wasn’t crazy - she read it and confirmed my thinking). She sent me another email about kids sports (which I had already sent her the schedule for earlier in the day). Another one telling me to call my neighbor because he owes my son money for chores. And another saying she signed up for some family software to manage our calendar, which had been written into our “agreement”.
Holy smokes. It almost ruined my first night with the kids in five days; I was really on tilt.
But, I’m glad I stood my ground and stuck up for myself. This was not a time to listen and validate or to be a patsy. She needs to stop trying to control me and push me around. She used to do this all the time, she would say I agreed to something that I never agreed to and then claim I was changing the truth; this time it’s literally in writing and she STILL claims I’m changing the story. It’s crazy. I remember clearly going over our arrangement with the mediator and the mediator telling her she couldn’t control me and that I could make my own decisions.
Maybe somewhere here would say I should have handled something differently. Maybe i should not have replied to her email that accused me of “violations.” My reply was short and direct. Maybe when she stopped by i should not have said anything to her at all. But at some point, I can’t stand by and allow this behavior to continue. I’m getting divorced and I can’t let her beat on me anymore. That’s got to end.
Wow. Overall, good job. However, IF you have the legal standing to go to FL based on the agreement.....WHO CARES what she thinks? Chasing her out to the car wanting to discuss it is not DBing. That is pressure. That is literally pursuit!
Remember, be firm, resolved, not angry or mean.
She is actually better at this than you are. She is keeping all of your communications in writing in email. That should be your tact as well.
Email from WAS: "You violated the mediation agreement by traveling." Email response: "No I didn't. I will discuss this with my lawyer." (Note, I don't care that you agreed to mediation, D is a legal proceeding and even with mediation you need a lawyer to understand your rights and what is legal!)
Then drop it.
"Maybe somewhere here would say I should have handled something differently. Maybe i should not have replied to her email that accused me of “violations.” My reply was short and direct. Maybe when she stopped by i should not have said anything to her at all. But at some point, I can’t stand by and allow this behavior to continue. I’m getting divorced and I can’t let her beat on me anymore. That’s got to end. "
Where did she try to beat on you? In her opinion the mediation agreement said that you couldn't travel. In yours it allows it. So talk to a lawyer and understand it.
In the future, do not let her know your comings and goings. When she has the kids, that is SCOTT TIME. Go do what Scott wants to do. Your kids don't need to know. Your STBXW doesn't need to know. I have to wonder if the letting your son know about the Florida trip was secretly an attempt to get that information to her. Scott, if that is even true in the slightest, you need to reign that in. Detached people do not do those kinds of things. AND they almost always backfire on you.
At minimum, never chase her out to the car no matter what she is accusing you of. SHE isn't the one you need to worry about. The mediator and a judge are.
One last thing. Likely, if she is making this false accusation it is because she doesn't like the way mediation is going. I based that on her baseless accusations in the first mediation, and then jumping on the first thing (your travel) she could to try to say you violated the mediated agreement. Likely she is about to go the nuclear option. You need to lawyer up.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
You are letting her light you up . Don’t engage. You are the only one to enforce your boundary. You can’t stop her from what she chooses to say or do, but you can chose how to handle it .
My ex boyfriend had a very contentious relationship with his ex wife. They communicate with an app, they have a court appointed parent coordinator and exchanged their kid at the police station.
Your relationship isn’t there. But one thing that always impressed me was how he kept his cool. He relied on the facts he knew to be true. He kept everything honest and real that he knew any ridiculous complaint or accusation that could made was covered .
If you know for sure that agreement said nothing about agreeing not to travel, then you have no reason to engage. You should be the one walking away, not her.
Calm cool collected responses if you are going to respond. “ I will have my lawyer look at the agreement to be clarified” done.
I was very explosive in the beginning. Emotional. I spoke on emotion. I yelled on emotion. I understand it. But learn that you can’t stop her from “lighting you up” but you can chose to walk away from it and not engage
