WAW Hired a Divorce Coach (Cont8.)

[Ready2Change]

A goal for me was to always double the amount of time between feeling like this. If the last time was a day ago, then I would focus on making it two days. Then 4, then 8.

My goal is to release any repressed emotions when it is safe to do so. If a sad (or angry) song comes on and I am in a safe place, I completely let the feeling flow through me and I cry, or scream or whatever expression of emotion that needs to be let out. Stuffing down emotions is not healthy. Expressing emotions at the wrong time and or place is also not good.

[ScottB]

CW: The actual argument was ridiculous in my opinion. I didn't like her tone, I felt that she wasn't thinking through my perspective - she would say the same about me. She was a bit high maintenance and had some perspectives I disagreed with. She was a bit of a snob as well. I was fine with it ending, its better off this way. I have no regrets.

In the relationship I was seeing some patterns of mine I need to work on. I do have a habit of asking for permission when I don't need to - I do that because I am used to it frankly. I really struggle to communicate my feelings and emotions - I literally get tongue tied when I try to go there. I think it makes me feel vulnerable and afraid I'll get rejected. I tend to care too much about what other people think. And I struggle to be open and direct when I'm not sure about what I want.

R2C: By good, I meant major. It happened on Sunday morning. I didn't call her to discuss it. We then took it to texting through the day Monday - it was heated. I had my kids that day and I was tired that night so I didn't call her. On Tuesday when I got home with my kids from school some things were sitting on her porch that I had left at her house. I then called her and it went straight to VM - I've got a feeling she blocked me. I also sent her a brief text with no reply. Weird to me to close it off when we had been seeing each other since before Easter; and odd to not at least talk without closing it down but whatever.

And on emotional release I tend to either do it by turning the music up in my car all the way and singing along to whatever it might be or to the occasional guttural scream - that seems to help to.

[SteveLW]

Scott, I think the breakup is a good thing. And maybe the R was good too based on you recognizing there are still things you could work on.

My wish for you would be to take the time to be happy alone, continue to become the best version of yourself, and then you can be the healthy half of a couple in the future. I think you used this R as a way to get over your MR. And that never goes well for the new R, and it stunts your personal growth that should follow the loss of a MR.

As far as the emotional release, I have one word: Pantera

[Traveler]

Weird to me to close it off when we had been seeing each other since before Easter; and odd to not at least talk without closing it down but whatever.

I'm glad you have no regrets. I don't particularly want another high-maintenance partner, either. A 2-day argument only one month into a relationship would likely have me pulling the plug like you two with no regrets. If you two can't communicate during the honeymoon phase, what about when life gets hard?

I would consider the 180 Ready2Change mentions. Meeting arguing, "heated exchanges", and a tone--with arguing and "heated exchanges"--escalates situations whereas listening and validating deescalates. I could handle a "medium-maintenance" partner, by enforcing boundaries without adding fuel to the fire.

I really struggle to communicate my feelings and emotions - I literally get tongue tied when I try to go there. I think it makes me feel vulnerable and afraid I'll get rejected.

Deep stuff. If the relationship had helped you spot patterns and things to work on it was valuable. I can really relate to sometimes struggling to be genuine. It’s brave and vulnerable.

Consider the book Daring Greatly by Brene Brown.

[Ready2Change]

Weird to me to close it off when we had been seeing each other since before Easter; and odd to not at least talk without closing it down

I believe everything happens for a reason and that every relationship is a mirror to reflect our issues back at us. It is real easy to see the issues the other person has. A lot harder to see our own. Relationships are 50/50 no more, no less.

If you can look hard at yourself, you may be able to see the RED FLAGS she saw. That is the challenge.

[BL42]

ScottB,

I received the division of assets from her team and it was only off of my expectation by $100k. The support figure was spot on what I expected. I still do not feel good about the overall situation but getting the numbers a bit tighter is good.

Sounds like we're in a very similar stage in the process. I found myself over-analyzing the financials and being anxious at the outcome, so getting the details on paper and finalized has relieved some of that stress and distraction. Hopefully you can lock in a favorable outcome an not have to worry about that aspect any more.

Change the way you interact with women. Commit to not arguing. Show women in your life that you are in control of your emotions and that you can handle every emotion they throw at you. When I find myself starting to argue with my woman, I intentionally stop. We are both being controlled by our emotions. I switch to listening and validation. Arguing means both people are not listening. I decided to be just the listener. I can share my thoughts with her later when we are both calm. Listen to her to understand her. She will calm down when you are listening. She will calm down after a period of time. Same thing with my kids.

Interesting perspective. I've read a lot about validation and am trying to practice it with my friends and family. I started a program for separated / divorced individuals and hearing them complain about their exs and the exchanges of blame they've had, it made me think of this forum and validation - let them know you are listening and recognize their opinion but don't necessarily apologize or agree with it, and avoid "battling" and engaging in arguments or drama.

[ScottB]

Crazy.

After I posted, the girl I was dating called twice that evening. I was busy and agreed to call her back the next day. I expected that call to be a simple - you're good, I'm good, we're not good together, its all good. I was wrong.

I called her, she accused me of being an unfeeling narcissist and she questioned my integrity in the relationship. She said I obviously didn't have the feelings I said I had or I wouldn't have just let go. I explained my perspective and said that I wasn't interested in being talked down to with contempt, that I was not interested in passive aggressive tactics and criticism and that I wanted someone that understood how to validate my feelings as opposed to playing devils advocate or telling me why I was wrong.

So she began to understand my perspective, and she began to feel horrible about the whole thing and we left off with me telling her I needed time to think things through. Then over the next couple of days she continued to annoy me with texts.

Now here is where I fail. I have a problem where I look for the approval of others. I am not good with people thinking I'm a jerk - that's where I get looped in. I called her Saturday to re-affirm that it was over, but she didn't pick up. I called her Sunday to tell her it was over but she was in the middle of a family situation and I didn't feel it was right to drop bad news on her.

Then on Monday she called and I thought it would be the end but instead she continued to tell me how she could help me and how she could make me happy. I told her I needed time and the reality is I ended up confusing myself - which is where I am now.

I think the antics from the previous week were actually a way for her to reposition things so that she would have the upper hand in the relationship and she was floored that I didn't come crawling back. Once that didn't happen, she started to re-assess her plans, because she doesn't want me to actually walk away.

And then in my brain I vacillate between just wanting some peace to myself and thinking, well, she's pretty good - what if I never find anything better. I am a moron.

But I've learned a lesson - which is good - one of my massive downfalls is the search for the approval of others. It is an easy way for me to be manipulated and its not something that is easy for me to turn off. So that will be the next thing I work on - add it to the list.

Steve: I do think the relationship was giving me a lot of feedback regarding things for me to work on. That was probably the best part of it.

CW: And I agree, I just can’t have a high maintenance partner in life. I want someone laid back at this point. A friend of mine said an argument like this, this early in a relationship is a major red flag. I think I agree. The only counterpoint would be that at some point you need to learn to work through things together – but if you give me a hard time because I woke you from a mid Sunday afternoon nap to do work on your house, when you have no kids and nothing to do, and I’m rushing to get to my kids sporting events, come on. I don’t need that. I do need to continue to work on validation and at some point I’ll reread the book “The Art of Listenning”. I put the Brene Brown book in my amazon shopping cart to consider in the future.

R2C: I agree; I played my role. I was seeking approval and trying to do something for her she didn’t want or ask me to do. That helped cause the breakdown. The night before, I was insensitive and didn’t pick up on some things I had said that hurt her, that didn’t help either. Regarding controlling one’s emotions, I think they are important to control but also important to feel. My survival strategy has been not to feel – I don’t think that is healthy.

BL42: The process is brutal because its constant. You can be having a good day and then you get an email or call from one of the attorneys. I hate it. I just can’t wait until its over.

[SteveLW]

I always think of Frank Barone from Everybody Loves Raymond in situations like this. In an episode where Robert pretends to be Raymond to get with a woman, and everyone ends up thinking Raymond is messing around, Franks says:

"What's a matter with you? Didn't I teach you that when you are having problems with a woman you don't go out and get another one? Now you just have two problems!!"

Last thing Scott needed was a sorta, maybe, kind of breakup with woman trying to convince him to give her a chance.

My advice, call her tonight and decisively tell her in no uncertain terms that is over. Do not make excuses. Do not beat around the bush. Do not NOT do it because her parents are there and you don't want to hurt her in front of them. I think if you've learned nothing else from the end of your marriage it should be that small problems early in an R turn into huge problems later on in an R. Be glad she flaked on you now, and not in 10 years, after 2 kids and 8 years of marriage.

[Ready2Change]

My advice, call her tonight and decisively tell her in no uncertain terms that is over. Do not make excuses. Do not beat around the bush.

I would not initiate contact. If she contacts you, politely state this "I believe it is best if we ________"

You can fill in the blank.

Do not justify your answer. Listen to her and validate. Then follow through with whatever your blank is.

[Ready2Change]

R2C... Regarding controlling one’s emotions, I think they are important to control but also important to feel.

Absolutely. Completely feeling, expressing and/or releasing emotions when it is safe is also extremely important.

My survival strategy has been not to feel – I don’t think that is healthy.

Then you most likely have many repressed emotions. There are triggers that may cause repressed emotions to get released at the wrong time, place or focused on the wrong person at the wrong level. There are healthy ways to release these as well. Part of the process.