Picking Up the Pieces After WAW Goes Again #3

[SteveLW]

Smilie, please go read:

https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2823726#Post2823726

Read that and will read it a few times. It does feel like you will die, or more importantly that your life will go downhill and you'll be left on the streets with nothing - well, that's the story I'm telling myself at the moment. Be careful what you wish for, eh?

My brain finds it hard to do generalisations, such as "do the work", "let go" and "look after you". The same answer to all three is "How?". How do I do what work? How do I finally let go after just 10 short weeks? ... and ... How DO I let go?

As far as "the work" is concerned, I would imagine that made up of GALing, ICing, Reading & learning and in my case, getting as well as I can by sorting out this VM condition I have. For me it all rests on creating an income and that must be my focus when I get myself sorted.

Letting go is the hard bit, if that means just accepting that it is what it is, the relationship is over and I need to get on with my life on my own and build it up once again for the 5th time in my life and hopefully the last. How does one stop thinking about the other person they have shared the last 19 years with? I don't want to think about her all the time, it just happens. I don't like what I see in her now though and that has to help some way I would hope. I do feel worn out at the moment - stress, panic, emotional pain, lack of sleep and not sure if I have the strength to do that, but then again I'm still standing so I must have something somewhere that I didn't realise I had.

Looking after me? Being kind to myself? Making sure I'm ok? I don't suppose I've done that for a long time and will need to learn again.

I disagree with your assessment that you need to have money to GAL, etc. Even ICing, there are some free resources out there if a person is so motivated to find them. Especially someone that is no or low income. But I did both. I did paid GAL, free GAL, paid IC and improvements, and free improvements. I truly believe that where there is a will, there is a way. We had a LBS here a while back that made all sorts of excuses as to why he couldn't GAL, or IC, or 180/self-improve. The truth was he liked to sit and stew in his own juices and feel sorry for himself. His recovery was long and stunted as a result. He finally jumped into a new R, and I am guessing he has a future BD coming his way because he didn't do the work.

Getting over someone is not easy. The only thing I have seen that helps is time. The more time that goes by the more clarity you will get. LBSs have a way of romanticizing how perfect their MR pre-BD was, and that they have no idea how they'll move on without all of that wedded bliss with that person. The truth is most of us were pretty miserable in our MR as well, but we forget that when the flight or flight instinct kicks in. Give yourself time. This is a marathon, not sprint. Be patient with yourself.

But yes, go learn those skills: looking after yourself, being kind to yourself, and making sure you are ok. That is DETACHMENT!

One thing is for sure though, the people here are amazing. You are all my support network at the moment and I feel so grateful to each and every one of you. I don't think any of you will ever know how much it means just for you to be there, to offer support - or a stern tongue - and all just for the love of your fellow man (in my case). I shall be eternally grateful and will certainly pay it forward when I have the opportunity to do so.

Agree. That is why I spend so much time here. My sitch turned around (not in a D vs. R way, but in an attitude and approach) when I found this forum. I am forever indebted to the posters here!

[Ready2Change]

My brain finds it hard to do generalizations, such as "do the work", "let go" and "look after you". The same answer to all three is "How?". How do I do what work? How do I finally let go after just 10 short weeks? ... and ... How DO I let go?

The generalization is the foundation.

So "Do the work" is the foundation for personal growth/change. Maybe you can identify 5 areas in your life that you would like to improve. Lets use "Attraction" as one area that we can improve. Still general, but more specific. Then we need to identify what women in general find attractive about men. We read that women are attracted to confident men. Others advise that we should hit the gym. Others say they like a man that uses humor. Identify the areas here that you want to work on.
At some point, you have to change your behavior. Maybe you wake up an hour earlier than normal and lift weights. Maybe you make different choices for breakfast. Maybe you go shopping for some new stylings clothing.

"Let go"-Your thoughts are controlling you. Learn to control your thoughts. The stop sign technique is good. Learning to stay in the present is helpful. Set goals, focus your actions on the goals. Rewiring your brain takes time. Start collecting mantras such as "I do not want to be with a woman who does not want to be with me" and "I do not share my woman with other men".

"Look after you" - When you wake up, do not think, just be. Lay in bed and focus on breathing in and out deeply. Focus on how it feels. It is a good feeling. Get in the shower. Again no thinking, just feel how good the warm water feels. Stay in the moment. I have several different smelling shampoos. I pick on and enjoy the smell. Do things like this throughout the day. Enjoy every interaction with others.

Read the four agreements. Every time I read it, I get something new from it.

[smilie]

As far as "the work" is concerned, I would imagine that made up of GALing, ICing, Reading & learning and in my case, getting as well as I can by sorting out this VM condition I have. For me it all rests on creating an income and that must be my focus when I get myself sorted.

I disagree with your assessment that you need to have money to GAL, etc. Even ICing, there are some free resources out there if a person is so motivated to find them. Especially someone that is no or low income.

I didn't mean it in that way! :-) I should have used a different paragraph, but I was saying that I need to focus on making an income when get myself sorted, aka. relocated. It wasn't meant to indicate that I need to have an income to GAL - certainly not!

We had a LBS here a while back that made all sorts of excuses as to why he couldn't GAL, or IC, or 180/self-improve. The truth was he liked to sit and stew in his own juices and feel sorry for himself. His recovery was long and stunted as a result. He finally jumped into a new R, and I am guessing he has a future BD coming his way because he didn't do the work.

I certainly don't want to sit and stew and I don't want to feel sorry for myself either. I just try to solve this problem that I'm living in. Even my friend said today that it can only be solved by hearing from the court about maintenance, or scrapping going for maintenance and instead agree to go our own separate ways without claim upon each other, otherwise my thinking will just keep going around in circles as the situation isn't changing.

I would also like to be able to move on as quickly as I can and I did have a plan...and now I feel stuck again.

I spent a couple of days away looking at houses in a cheap part of the country. Did I want to live there? No, not really as it was fairly run-down, hence cheap. Could I live there for a while to heal, focus on me, build myself back up? Certainly I could. I made arrangements, was sorting things out and then I mentioned it to my lawyer, who told me to put it on hold for a few days as it would affect my spousal maintenance claim and we were waiting to hear back from the court. Did I take her advice? Yes, I did and it hasn't worked out very well and now it's gone over time the estate agents are on my case asking if I'm ready to fill the forms in to rent the place. I've explained the situation about waiting on the courts still, they have not been in this position before but relayed the information to the landlords who will probably pull out and stick it back on the rental market, even though I have asked what would it take to keep it from being put back up for rent.

I have spoken to my friend to try to get some perspective, I have spoken to the doctor to get some sleeping tablets as I cannot function on less than 3 hours sleep a night like I have been for over 10 weeks. I've also started to get the packing sorted - far too many things and I have once again been looking at houses on advice from my lawyer - there is none in this area.

It's like Groundhog Day just waiting to hear from the court and that's not in my control, but each day goes by costs me more money that I can ill-afford, as I need to pay rent on the house that I am in, into September now - this was not part of the plan, but has been created by following my lawyer's advice.

I did paid GAL, free GAL, paid IC and improvements, and free improvements. I truly believe that where there is a will, there is a way.

I'm not saying that I can't GAL, I feel stuck as to how. I feel that I must spend the time of the day trying to sort out the issues that I have, trying to sort out possessions and pack, keep the house in good order, look after the huge gardens, etc and try to complete looking for a place to live, away from here.

I spend an hour or so a day just recently talking to support people on the telephone as I feel like an emotional wreck, born out of acting on the advice from my lawyer. I'm second guessing what I think is good for me and where to live and it's driving me nuts - literally.

My plan was to move then GAL, as I would have my own space then and be somewhat settled. While I'm here I feel so stressed as I feel that time is running out. It has been since the start as my stbxw told me that she would pay for things until the end of August - she renegged on that promise and began cancelling things without notice or communication, but the phone an internet is still there so I'm trying to get loads of things sorted. I don't sit down all day - apart from on the PC looking for properties. I spend an hour in the evening looking through posts here - I read them all but can't comment on any as I don't have the insights or knowledge that you guys have. I would like to though.

It would be nice to see what others had been doing for GAL, but I can't seem to search the forums thoroughly. I have been trying to get IC since my wife left and it took 7 weeks for CBT to start and then after 4 weeks they say that it's not suitable for me at the moment and that I need relationship counselling. so they have put me forward for that and there is a 12 week lead time. They will drop the CBT immediately seeing as they have now referred me on - so once again I'm on my own for at least 3 months and then I would have moved and had to start all over again with a different state body.

I did start GAL right at the start of all this. I was training as best I could in my little home gym, trying to push through the panic attacks, I was going to the park for a couple of hours to read and learn things, I was typing a journal so I could work through stuff and then things kept getting more pressured as the days went on and I got more anxious and had less time and now I'm at the whim of the courts, worrying about the outcome and if I will lose this house. I'm trying to ask myself if I should let it go and look for one elsewhere, as if may not be the right house for me. But either way, all the cheaper houses are in the same area, so I'll have an issue with any and all.

Getting over someone is not easy. The only thing I have seen that helps is time. The more time that goes by the more clarity you will get.

I shall hang on to your every word here - I long for that time.

LBSs have a way of romanticizing how perfect their MR pre-BD was, and that they have no idea how they'll move on without all of that wedded bliss with that person. The truth is most of us were pretty miserable in our MR as well, but we forget that when the flight or flight instinct kicks in. Give yourself time. This is a marathon, not sprint. Be patient with yourself.

I haven't been romanticizing and our marriage was far from perfect and I would not try to make it out as such. It seemed good for a lot of the time though and it appeared that we were closer than a lot of other relationships that we knew and witnessed - obviously I was wrong as mine didn't last.

Time will tell, yes. I just need to get through the next couple of days hoping I will hear from the court. This is what I worry about and try to find a solution, I can't and it pains me.

Sorry about the length...I did shorten it a tad. :-)

[MrBrside]

I'm in South Norfolk (just down from Norwich).

It's taking me ages to be able to post on the forum or even see posts, not sure if it's just me, but I hope that you can get access to this. I can't private message you either, as my membership level doesn't allow for that.

Thats a fair treck from me unfortunetly. Appologies for the delay in replying - I couldnt login on Monday when i tried ( assume update issue )

Onward and Upward !

and as for solicitors - get everything in writing if possible. What they quote and what they bill always differ ! - Mine tried to bill be 50% more than the initial quote for work !

[smilie]

I'm in South Norfolk (just down from Norwich).

It's taking me ages to be able to post on the forum or even see posts, not sure if it's just me, but I hope that you can get access to this. I can't private message you either, as my membership level doesn't allow for that.

Thats a fair treck from me unfortunetly. Appologies for the delay in replying - I couldnt login on Monday when i tried ( assume update issue )

No worries!

How many miles is it from me to you then? Just for the sake of it.

Onward and Upward !

and as for solicitors - get everything in writing if possible. What they quote and what they bill always differ ! - Mine tried to bill be 50% more than the initial quote for work !

I did want to discuss fixed fee, but then it became irrelevant apparently because of this maintenance claim thing. I need to get my head around it as I don't want to spend any more really, it's all getting a bit unnecessary perhaps?

I'm seriously considering jacking it in what the solicitor is trying to do - claim maintenance. I still haven't heard back from her about the court hearing and it's been 2 weeks now. It was supposed to be sorted in 4 days. Because of the waiting I am on the verge of losing the house I was going to rent. I see little point in paying out all of my pension money on solicitors fees, just to claim maintenance. I may as well use my pension money to live and be free from the stbxw - that was my original plan.

So I am thinking of telling the solicitor not to worry about maintenance and just make my stbxw an offer for us to relinquish all claims against each other and just get the divorce done. No financial stuff to worry about, no headaches. This entire waiting around business has had a seriously adverse effect on my well-being to the extent that I haven't been able to function properly and am consumed by worry about not being able to get on with my life.

The other alternative is to request my dental claim money that was taken without permission, to be returned, or at least 50% of it if we're being fair.

I'm still pondering.....

[Ready2Change]

I see little point in paying out all of my pension money on solicitors fees, just to claim maintenance. I may as well use my pension money to live and be free from the stbxw - that was my original plan.

My X spent more on legal fees than she got from me in child support. If my X would have took the money she spent on legal fees and invested it, she would have 5X.

Best thing is to understand the system and your legal rights as well as protect yourself financially.

You have 3 people that want your money. You X, her lawyer and your lawyer. Two get your money by arguing (Negotiating).

I feel for you. This stuff is not easy.

[Traveler]

I see little point in paying out all of my pension money on solicitors fees, just to claim maintenance. I may as well use my pension money to live and be free from the stbxw - that was my original plan.

So I am thinking of telling the solicitor not to worry about maintenance and just make my stbxw an offer for us to relinquish all claims against each other and just get the divorce done. No financial stuff to worry about, no headaches.

smile, it's a financial calculation. Try to set aside feelings. Try to set aside what you've already spent. Your attorney should be able to tell you roughly how much more settling would cost, roughly how much more fighting would cost, your odds if you fight, and what you're likely to win.

E.g., if settling gets you $5,000 and costs nothing more, and fighting gets you an 80% shot at $10,000 and costs you $5,000, you'd want to settle. E.g., if you fight your expected outcome would be less than if you were to settle: -$5000 + 0.2 x $5000 + 0.8 x $10000 = $4,000.

I hired a more expensive attorney but paid less in legal fees than my ex. I never asked them to read or answer a long e-mail. My questions to them were short and precise.

[smilie]

I'm not fighting..... it hasn't got to the finance bit yet, just trying to negotiate interim maintenance so that I can live in the immediate term. The nature of the way she left has left me in the lurch and the pension that came out has made things a tad awkward.

Finally my case for interim maintenance was listed with the court today, some two weeks late. It can take up to another 2 weeks to get heard. It was supposed to have been listed on 26th July and I would have know the verdict by now.

My lawyer has had a couple of letters from the stbxw's and it would appear that she cancelled all the household utilities the day she left. Like I have said before, it has all been ruthlessly planned and she has lied through her teeth, without humility.

So she sent me a text message when she dumped me, saying that she would not abandon me and she would pay the rent and bills until the end of August. I have this is writing and I have this as a recorded phone call - she had cancelled everything two days before sending that message and has only just announced this 11 weeks later and having been given ample opportunity to do so previously.

- She paid one month's rent out of the money she took from my bank account.
- She has cancelled the utilities (gas, water, electric) in her name on the day she left.
- She has arranged to cancel internet and phone from 31 August.

Apparently she shouldn't have done these things without there being a maintenance agreement in place, as they are utilities and you need them to live. And internet is the arguably a similar status same now as people are dependent on it. She has gone ahead closed accounts, informed utility suppliers that I am now paying for bills, etc., all without informing me or my lawyer. Just kept it all as a little secret to be sprung out just today. My lawyer has challenged this.

She has also offered me a quarter of what is being claimed for monthly in maintenance, is far below that which anybody would be able to live on and doesn't meet my outgoings, but shows that she agrees maintenance is needing to be paid by her and has opened the door for communications - preferred by the court. She has also suggested that I pay half of my pension that she arranged to withdraw, into her account now. It is suspected - by me and a colleague of my lawyer's - she has suggested this so that she can use that to pay me maintenance payments, using my own money, just as she did with the rent.

Also a comment made by her lawyer (maybe via her perhaps), has been picked up by my lawyer as inciting fraud. She has commented on it as such in her response to them.

She is also making up stories, as her lawyer has quoted in her letter, that I have never been interested in financial matters - totally fabricated, as I was always making sure with her that things were ok, as I was so conscious of mot being able to bring home an income.

All this has been so frustrating and things just keep appearing continually. I just can't see why she couldn't have just sat down and discussed this stuff, rather than act in such ludicrous, unpredictable and secretive ways. There's nothing adult about this in the slightest. Cancelling things without prior communication is an awful thing to do IMO.

Perhaps I'm not understanding something here and I don't want to come across foolish.

The house I was going to move to I think has fallen through as I was waiting to hear from the court sooner. They've pulled out and are re-marketing it. My fault. I did offer to pay a month rent to hold the property so that I would know my position more fully. They said they were going to call me Monday to see what's happening, but I feel so unsure now. Something doesn't feel quite right but I can't place a finger on it. Not sure if it's something to do with attachment to her, here or the area I have lived around all of my life or something else. The town I was planning to move to was a fairly run down. But that was why the rent was cheaper!

Another week next week - full of surprises no doubt. I do wonder each and every day, how I will get through this turmoil. It is the most unpleasant place I've been in my entire 55 years of existence. I'm sure that I will and I trust that "I will not die.".

[Traveler]

Apparently she shouldn't have done these things.. My lawyer has challenged this.

So, applying the principles above: (a) How much will this challenge cost? (b) What is the probability of success, (c) if you win, what do you win? It's all a financial matter.

I just can't see why she couldn't have just sat down and discussed this stuff, rather than act in such ludicrous, unpredictable and secretive ways. Perhaps I'm not understanding something here and I don't want to come across foolish.

No lawyer I spoke to advised sitting down and discussing divorce in advance. It wasn't in my best interest. I didn't do that either. Again, she's probably doing what she feels is best for her and her chosen family. The impact on her matters. The impact on you doesn't matter. Simple enough?

[smilie]

I just can't see why she couldn't have just sat down and discussed this stuff, rather than act in such ludicrous, unpredictable and secretive ways. Perhaps I'm not understanding something here and I don't want to come across foolish.

No lawyer I spoke to advised sitting down and discussing divorce in advance. It wasn't in my best interest. I didn't do that either. Again, she's probably doing what she feels is best for her and her chosen family. The impact on her matters. The impact on you doesn't matter. Simple enough?[/quote]
I wasn't referring to the lawyer. I just don't know how all this happened this bad this quickly. A conversation could have been a starting point, but she chose this mess. And quite frankly, I'm not coping too well with all of this. I haven't been so panicky and so dizzy for so long for years.

It's all very callous.