Hi all - I have spent a considerable amount of time on these boards and I wish I would have found so much sooner. I didn't understand what was going on in my life with my wife and how my behavior and reactions put me in the situation that I'm in. This is my first post so bear with me. I'll try to give as much info as I can without being long winded.
My wife is definitely having a MLC. She is 49 and in the past 6 months or so has lost 20lbs, changed her wardrobe to much more revealing clothing - tasteful for the most part but a few outfits not appropriate, a lot of Botox, fillers, skin tightening procedures (no surgery as of yet), a whole new group of friends that she socializes with, much more drinking, spending money like crazy.
Our current situation is modified separation but living under the same roof, I sleep on the couch. We have to children D9 & D12 and stepson 26 so most of our conversations revolved around them. There is occasional intimacy but it is referred to as sex not ML - I have questions for the group about this. No OP for either of us but I suspect an EA with a much younger man. There have been a few times asking for a divorce has been mentioned, her moving out or asking me to move out, her saying she is going to remove her rings but so far that is just talk - none of it has happened. Oh yes - I have gotten the ILYBNILWY a few times. Some days she says she wants this to work out, other days she is saying maybe she wants to see other people. I know....don't believe anything she says. We have been married for 19 years and together for 26. She has told me that she was unhappy in the marriage the entire time and that she has been a verbally battered wife the entire time. I have never laid a hand on her but definitely own the verbally abusive part at times. We had an extremely happy marriage IMO up until about 6-8 months ago when I think MLC really took hold. I think its important to mention that my wife has been on hormone replacement therapy for about a year now. She believes its a god send and has helped her physically and mentally. I do believe the physically part but not sure on the mentally. I have read online that HRT can help with MLC but I honestly dont know. I am hopeful that it shortens the lifespan of it!
I started really employing DB techniques about 2 weeks ago. Before then, I made most of the same mistakes others have made - begging, bribing, constant R talks, etc. All of which drive her further away. Since then I've notice some slight changes in her behavior towards me at times. Still very angry at me most days but a little more talkative. One of her complaints throughout our R is that she wanted more attention. So the DB techniques were hard because I thought that it would push her further away. But I'm coming around to the fact that I was wrong.
I honestly don't know what phase of her MLC journey she is in because its not day to day - its minute to minute how she act. I really believe that the hormone replacement therapy plays a roll in how she feels at certain times. I have a ton of questions for the group and could provide more details on my current situation. I am so thankful to have found this website. I have spent hours on the internet researching my situation and this has been by far the most helpful.
Hi Keyes I am so sorry to hear what you are going through. I am early in my journey ( 7 months since BD and 4.5 months since H moved out). These boards are so full of amazing posts and amazing people. They are all here to hold your hand. I am a newbie so I would let the experts jump in but honestly read DR then re read it. Then read on this forum all rhe pinned threads as well as MLc. The MLC board has great pinned posts too. Sounds like your wife is seeking a lot of attention. It s*cks. It really does. My heart Is still wounded but we pick ourselves up dust ourselves off and keep going. This is their journey their crisis.I would try really hard to let go of the glimmers of hope or small things that do us LBS seem like they are coming around. They arent( or not her anyway). Keep reading keep posting the regulars will chime In with some amazing pears of wisdom. Hang in there, there’s enough of us here to support you through this
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
Thank you Pattnee5 - the struggle is real. I have read and read and read as much as I can. My head is going to explode with all of the information on here. Just like everyone else in our situation, I just want my W back. The alien who took over her body is not who I married. I have good days and bad days. We still do things as a family and act as if its normal around other friends and family but in private its far from normal. I would do anything to get back to where we were but I realize after all of the damage that has been done, we will never be the same. My biggest concern is the PA. I know how common it is in this stage and she has denied one. We both have location tracking on our iphones so I know where she is most time and I confess to checking. But she works with someone who I suspect at the very least she is having an EA with so its possible the PA could have occurred. That would be the deal breaking and the end of our marriage so I pray it hasn't and won't happen.
Its honestly the roller coaster of highs and lows that are the killer. One minute I think we're on good footing and the next we're back in a bad place. DB techniques have helped. I want more than anything to save this marriage and not break up family. Truth be told, its probably as much about my kids or more that I want this to work out.
Welcome to the boards. I am copying Cadet’s welcoming post for your reference. There are many links with much useful information.
Do you have a copy of Divorce Remedy? Do not share it, or this site, with your wife. She will rebel against such; see them as attempts to manipulate her. These resources are for you, keep them close to your vest. Purge the browser history on family shared computers, for example.
As for what stage of MLC W is likely in: Replay.
Bomb drop usually occurs near the start of replay. In lots on instances BD kicks off the replay/running stage. The preceding two stages - denial and anger - are still present and very much active; as they run from their lives and torment. They are a cauldron of emotions and are very confused. Depression is always present, underlying everything. Their path is emotional driven and fraught with poor decisions and bad choices. They are consumed by their pains and ceaseless torments. Desperate for relief or clarity. And desperate people do desperate things.
Be W’s journey a crisis, or perhaps a harder mid life transition, you’ve experienced how she will push back against relationship talks, begging, pleading, and such. For a person in crisis, anyone, anything, that gets in their way, will be mowed down. A MLCer is driven, and once a crisis starts nothing is going to stop it.
Long ago trauma(s), things the MLCer doesn’t even know about, were buried. These are usually childhood trauma(s) from an authority figure. The youngster, unable to cope, buries it. Enter midlife and that which was buried alive, now haunts. Their once silenced demons will no longer remain quiet and hidden, and suddenly burst forth. This is quite a confusing and horrible time for them.
Give time and space, for a MLCer needs it; and will take it regardless.
I too remember scouring the internet for some answer or explanation of my wife’s sudden and erratic behaviour. Finding this place was a god send.
There are many kind and compassion folks here, with much hard-earned wisdom.
I look forward to conversing with you.
DnJ
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Welcome to the board.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by Michele Weiner-Davis. The following link is the first chapter:
Once your registration to the site has been completed you can post and start a thread. Please have only one thread active at a time (per forum); it keeps your situation organized and is easier for those following along and posting to you. There are a few forums which help categorize posters’ situations.
When your thread reaches 100 posts, it will be time for you to start a new thread. It is a good idea to link your old thread to your new one, and even link the new one back to the previous one. That makes it easier for the folks following your story. (There is a help thread on linking in the sticky threads at the top section of the forum’s display.) A moderator will “close” your full thread which prevents further posting to it. It is still available to read.
Post in small frequent replies on your thread. Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity can be very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Post on other people’s thread to give support.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Thank you DnJ - I have read so much the past few weeks. A lot of Cadet's post and other I have read multiple times. It was a big step even posting on here. Its something I thought I would never be able to do but thats how much I appreciate and firmly believe in this website.
I have a question regarding intimacy. My W has said she doesn't want to have intimacy so she doesn't give me mixed signals or false hope. However, we have had sex on a few occasions since BD two months ago and as recently as two days ago. I have initiated it every time that I can remember with one exception when she did. I'm afraid to ask but should I stop trying to initiate it? If she is receptive to it then I was thinking it was a good thing. I found another thread on here where the response seemed divided on good or bad. As long as she isn't cake eating then I was thinking it was good for the R and keeping me in the game even while DB'ing. Thoughts?
There is nothing wrong with having sex. It’s enjoyable, fun, and might even stir some of those old feelings in her. You, don’t read too much into it. W is likely compartmentalizing sex from intimacy.
As you said, as long as there is no cake eating, it’s ok.
The potential downside is it prevents or hampers your detachment efforts.
Originally Posted by Keyser77
I'm afraid to ask but should I stop trying to initiate it?
One key DB item is, do more of what works and less of what doesn’t. For the time being, W is willing and even initiated things. It’s difficult to say, if you should alter the balance here. However, things might change anyhow with what I’m suggesting below.
Originally Posted by Keyser77
Our current situation is modified separation but living under the same roof, I sleep on the couch.
I’d suggest you reclaim the master bedroom again. Move back in. If she wants out of the marriage, she can sleep on the couch. Lots of folks walk on eggshells and don’t want to rock the boat. It’s a big 180 to not act out of worry and fear.
I read W49, D9, D12, and SS26. Married 19, together 26. How old are you?
I’m glad you posted. Yes, in that first post one is full of trepidation. Take care, you are among those that empathize and understand.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Thanks you DnJ - I appreciate the response and encouragement. I am 50 years old.
The not acting out of worry and fear is a big hurdle to overcome. I confess that in say ways I do but in a lot of other ways, I dont. I guess it depends on the situation. Regardless, I would say that I still do it and the walking on eggshells at the moment. Reading your suggestion of reclaiming the master bedroom gave me some butterflies. I would be nervous to do it. I feel like since I started DB about 2 weeks ago, I/we have made some progress. Talking a bit more, having civil discussion and small R talks but ONLY if she brings up. I have been 99 percent following DB rules for about 2 weeks now. I just wish I could fast forward in time and get her past this MLC. I should say, which I don't think that I have, that I am at fault for plenty of things. I caused problems with my actions and not fulfilling all of her basic needs. She keeps bringing up the fact that it took this to open my eyes so she harbors resentment. Any good deed or anything I do in a positive light looks fake to her and insincere which I totally get.
Does anyone have any experience with a spouse going through a MLC that has is on hormone replacement theropy?
I think my biggest lesson I have learnt the last few months is we can’t just appease their needs.we can’t do absolutely everything and let them run the show. It doesn’t work. It will burn you out. You need boundaries( as hard as that is). I was like you, too scared to do or say anything out of fear it would make it worse. Walking on eggshells etc. it doesn’t work. We can’t nice them back or hurry them through this but it also doesn’t mean we have to lose ourselves in the process of who we are. Did your W ever talk to you before this about those things “you were at fault” for? Because if she didn’t then that’s on her, we aren’t mind readers. H used the same argument with me about doing more housework( he worked from home and I had two jobs so he did more of the house duties during the day) he never said anything about it and his argument was “ I shouldn’t have to say anything you should just know “ 🙄 I think one thing I have gotten out of this lately is they play the victim so much and shift so much blame. Also don’t get too excited with the little things or read too much into them. Everyone used to tell me to believe nothing that they say and half of what they do. I would think they were glimmers of hope only to realise they weren’t or the roller coaster goes back down.
Try to just breathe, ground yourself, focus on you and less on what W is doing or not doing. Validate her talks but try not to her your hopes up( H kept doing this to me for 3 months ). It’s exhausting
As for the HRt is that more for menopause or for what she’s going through? I know they take a few months to kick in. No experience with it but seen enough women in my life go through peri menopause and menopause to know the hormones take on a life of their own( so do the women) and they need some pretty rock solid partner by their side for their support.
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
Yes - the HRT is for menopause and to balance out hormones. Physically it works quite well. Mentally, I'm not so sure. Having spoken to other husbands who have or had wives go through menopause, its not a smooth ride.
I admit fault in things that I have done. And my wife did talk to me about things. I dont necessarily agree with everything but if she feels a certain way, I shouldnt discount those feelings. And I have done some bad things - mainly being verbally abusive. Not name calling or yelling but small put downs, not showing enough attention or appreciation are the two main things. I have not been the perfect H. I dont want to go on and on about the good things that I do because I feel like that would be deflecting but I am not the monster she paints me out to be.
Yesterday we talked quite a bit. Just normal talk and spent time as family together. I'm trying not to read too much into it as I know this is a roller coaster ride but its hard not to be encouraged. I am still sticking to the DB rules.
One of the things I am struggling with is my wife LOOOOOVES attention from me - PDA, compliments, hand holding, etc. I didn't do is much as she wanted throughout the R. When will I know when its ok to start doing it more. I want to do it but I know it will come off as fake or desperate if I do it now. Is it gut instinct when to start? Yesterday when we were hanging out, I did do some small things but didn't want to break any rules.
You’re in great hands. We will help carry and support you through this journey.
I agree completely with the comments regarding moving back to the master bedroom. A large percentage of men who arrive at this site are living in fear or have been beaten into submission by a woman threatening to leave.
Ironically, you won’t be attractive if you keep trying to please or appease her. She won’t like it when you move back to the master bedroom. She may scream, yell, threaten or move to the couch herself.
Don’t react, don’t argue, don’t be controlling and just listen to her concerns.
“That sounds tough for you.” “It sounds like you’re upset about this.” “You must be confused I’m moving back to the bedroom.”
But don’t waiver. Make sure you move back in before telling her and when she’s gone out, so there’s no chance of physical conflict. The only thing to say other than the validation statements above is “I’m choosing not to leave this marriage and I’m sleeping in our bed. But if you don’t want to sleep here, I respect your choice.”
Know that while she will be angry (because women who attempt to control men by threatening divorce can’t stand it when they feel like they’re losing control of you), she will actually start to respect you for being a strong man.
Keep your emotions in check. Calm, reasonable, strong.
