For those who went and finalized divorce, how were the 1-2 months leading up to the finalizing of everything? When was the peak of emotional torment and height of depression?
I went from BD to divorced in two months. BD is a grand announcement at T-Day supper where W throws away the kids and me. Three hours later she’s gone to live with OM.
At bomb drop, utter shock, I was dumbfounded. Completely stunned. Days of “WTF happened? What am I going to do?”
Couple of days post BD, I cancelled credit cards. About a week in I saw a L regarding my will. Turns out, I couldn’t legally do anything when situation was/is such a state of flux. However, speaking with L, I recieved information about remortgaging, my best case scenario, as well as my worst case, and the likely case. Found out what is mandatory in a settlement and what is negotiable. (Information is power.)
My emotional torment continued until I received an email from my L during the kid’s Christmas concert (2 months after BD) that STBXW had signed the agreement. There was so much uncertainty until then: Could I keep the house?; Where would I and the kids live?; What about my pension? How much alimony any I going to have to pay? She has zero income so I would receive zero child support; and so on.
Once the settlement was signed, things were more settled. The agreement still had a one year cool down period before it could be send to the courts to be finalized. So, a bit of nail biting for the next while too. XW jumped the gun and forwarded the agreement on month elven. She even paid the court costs.
Once the legal/business side dust settled so did the emotional torment regarding living and providing for me and the kids. Certainty brought peace and financial security/protection.
Counterintuitively, embracing uncertainty for my emotional healing path brought peace. Unlike the business side, the emotional side required letting go of my ego, the need to be right or know or predict or have answers, etc. It truly was: Answers will/do present themselves when one is calm.
I found forgiveness for XW two months into my situation. Forgiveness for myself took about six months more. (Oh, her poisonous words were difficult to transmute. )
Anyhow, after a hellish nightmare in which XW was being eternally tortured and licked in flame, I bolted awake. At 2:00am, I fell to the floor, in total darkness, on my knees, and begged God to forgive her for she doesn’t deserve such a fate. Oh my, the hubris! Me, a mere mortal, telling God who should be forgiven.
In that moment, I realized I had forgiven XW. I gave her and her path to God. He is much much more wise than I. He will know what she deserves.
I also realized, I do not know enough to judge her. I cannot see all ends. Heck, if I had her upbringing, perhaps I’d be lost in a horrible crisis. I’d like to think not, however that’s my ego talking. That need to be right and in control. Set that side, and I can see how fortunate I truly was and are.
Still, XW is not given a free pass. Forgiveness is not that. Forgiveness sets you free. Free from needing retribution or retaliation. It writes paid in full on whatever invoice your heart is holding. It lets one unburden that heavy yoke of holding a grudge. And believe me, grudges are heavy! You forgive and still hold one accountable for their actions.
My depression? Oh my goodness.
My grief had very little anger. At first, I was full on in denial. So much happened, it was so unbelievable. Then word choice realization and revelation - me thinking and saying unbelievable makes it so. So, I was dumbfounded rather than it was unbelievable.
I found being accurate in thought and heart is very important to progressing and healing well. I worked to keep my heart soft and squishy. I did not want a hardened heart.
I did have bargaining. lol. Such a strange landscape. The stuff we promise God and ourselves to just have things go back to how there were. Ah, bargaining, the last vestige of the old normal. The harbinger of depression.
Depression is when one finally realizes the old normal is dead and gone. Depression take time. I spent a long time in depression. And then one day, one moment, it starts to be over. There is no warning, no bells or trumpet, it just happens. Depression will take as long as it takes, and will not be done one second sooner.
Of course, like all stages of grief, the delimitation is rather nebulous. I floated back and forth, in and out of depression for a while, before I realized I was much more over being depressed than being depressed.
I can still recall walking my dogs. It was another bland, gray, day. Another chore. Trudge trudge. But no. I heard something.
I heard a bird singing!
Oh my God! And yes, God! Thank you!
Bird song. I hadn’t realized how gray the my world had become. You’ll likely notice the strikethrough in the previous sentence. The world was still the same, my view changed.
Along with hearing birds again - and by the way it was months and months of not hearing them - color! The world exploded in color! Green leaves. Brown bark. Blue sky. White clouds.
Holy cow! I had forgotten.
Depression is dark and black. And I walked my way in it and through it. My best advice, and what I did, figure out your heading. What you believe in. Not feelings, not thoughts. Your convictions, your values. Those beliefs are slow to change and therefore make excellent headings, once they are organized. After all, we all have prejudices and ego and such to purge/let go of.
Like I said, it takes as long as it takes. I was working. Commuting two hours. Looking after the kids. Paying the bills. Buying food. Buying cars. Helping with university tuitions. All solo.
Working to be a lighthouse. A living example for my kids. Having many open honest discussions with them. By the way, they seemed to get through their depression faster than I.
Was there a high point of depression? No. Not really. That’s the depression part. You sink into depression, and then it’s flat. Same same. Day after day. It feels unending. Of course, it isn’t. Although it feels differently. Ha, feelings are fleeting. Let them flit.
Without some high point, or summit, one has no reference where they are in their depression. It’s just flat. No idea of how far left to traverse. Except, one day less to go than yesterday.
Originally Posted by Catman19
when does the stress and bitterness finally wear off?
When you find forgiveness.
There are different forms of acceptance. One could find a resigned acceptance of their lot in life. You get through your grief, yet still kind of resent where you now are.
I like a forgiving acceptance. Finding a peace and contentment with the hand you’ve be dealt. Nothing is so bad that it couldn’t be worse. I used to remind myself of that back when slogging through the mess. It’s quite uplifting in a weird sort of way. lol.
Sure, my present path is not what I had planned. Yet, I’d not give it up. There is a golden opportunity in all this. An opportunity few people, thankfully, ever get. And even fewer truly embrace.
Originally Posted by Catman19
what did you guys find worked best to get into a proper state of mind to get over the final hurdle?
Letting go.
Not defining the hurdle.
Ha, I’ve got a lot of inner zen. Remember, embrace the uncertainty.
When you make things a hurdle or problem, you set yourself and the stage that way. You now have to solve or overcome it. And fighting begets fighting. Hurdles and struggles, fight back.
Instead, come at things sideways. Certainly solve the business stuff. Then let go, let it wash over you, find your inner self, your convictions, and follow them. Regardless of the pressures of society or social media or well meaning friends.
An example: For better and for worse, til death do us part. We all likely said that in our vows. Or something like that. What does that mean to you? And be careful, us humans have a near infinite capacity to reason our way around things, especially things we don’t like.
To me, the meaning is pretty clear. So, I am being single. And plan to remain so. Not dating. Not looking. And not a widely held viewpoint either. Lots of folks have tried to help me see the light. “Life too short. You should have fun. And so on.”
Yes, life is short. So live it well! And fun/happiness comes from inside.
Of course, that’s me. You need to find your path. Your convictions.
Originally Posted by Catman19
Sometimes the life you have can give you all the happiness you desire if you chose to live in the moment and time.
Look who’s all zen-like. Well done. (Drop the sometimes by the way. It just is.)
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Thanks dnj, yeah im finding myself going through the different stages of grief and depression at a quicker rate now.
I too found myself asking God to help her and ive only asked of one thing from God for myself and that’s the strength to get through this and to be kind to others even though its easier sometimes to go back into my shell
I think whats made this extremely difficult for me is the fact we had a reconciliation attempt, she’s said things to me like shes sorry she hurt me, during R she said thank you multiple times for fighting for us, told me she loved me. Then after failed R shes had moments of opening up to me and apologizing somewhat sincerely but then gone back to chasing her other life. The thing that showed me i needed to put an end to this was when she started saying to me she thinks no one will want her, when it clearly seemed things weren’t going well with OM3 and i realized she was making me the shoulder to cry on when her poor life choices weren't working out.
All this back and forth has messed up my healing process, top it off with her delaying and delaying every step of the business end of separation, house sale, etc. Like she clearly wants another lifestyle but she wanted to keep me there on a short leash and this turned everything into a complete cluster*.
I had to start putting an end to the pendulum stuff because i knew she was reverting to the same pattern of keeping me as a backup like she did before our R attempt.
Ive studied so much about narcissisim and npd and during marriage something always felt off. Like arguments out of the blue followed by normal days like nothing happened the day after, verbal abuse followed by demand to initiate sex right after. It felt like torture.
I so feel some closure now in seeing that she likely has npd, like basically you are an object to them and seen as just a source of supply and nothing you do can fix them, it is who they are for life. They go through idealization, devaluation, discard cycles with partners, and seeing her do this with om3 going onto om4 and the patterns repeated like clockwork, I realized I had to end this for my own sake.
I guess for me now focusing on the light at the end of the tunnel gives me somewhat of a vision of the future and new life I'd like to have and at least these thoughts are dominating more than the thoughts of what was.
In the end the only way she'll ever properly value me is not having me in her life and the only way I'll regain a closer semblance to my full self is to do the same
The days aren't easy to get through but I'm only 1.5 months away from it all being finished so I guess I have to remain steadfast on that.
Thank you for your experience recap it gives a good perspective from someone who's gone through the whole thing, although all our experiences aren't exactly the same, the self care and personal work required is as close as it can get.
Last edited by DnJ; 05/07/2402:12 PM. Reason: Corrected typo.
So an update. 2 days ago, i send her 2 messages first one is "I need you to bring the big luggage so i can start packing" second message "Can you use the actuary the mediator recommended to get your pensiion valuation because we arent going to get it on time and separation agreement wont be readiy by house closing"
STBXW Replies : "From now on dont send me these messages. Its been a year and a half since we split up. Please only message me if its in regards to the house or finalizing the divorce. If you are having a hard time please reach out to a friend or your conselor. Thank you"
Now this message seems heavily coached, and i wouldnt be suprised if shes been playing the victim card to new guy and he had a hand in crafting this message for her. Like this is how you deal with your troublesome ex.
This kind of stuff is infuriating to me. Ive been trying to get her to either work on marriage or sell the house last year and since march of last year ive been trying to sell the house so i can move on. Ive had agreement papers thrown in my face to sell house. Ive had 3 month delay on destroying embryos. Delays on mediation documentation, now shes delaying taking her things from the house. At this point house closes by end of June and shes barely taken anything from the home. Im now considering getting the lawyer involved as its becoming ridiculous that i feel im dealing with a child. Shes skiritng her responsibilities and if this house isnt clear by closing we are liable to being sued by buyers.
Just the sheer audacity to send a message like that to me.
So an update. 2 days ago, i send her 2 messages first one is "I need you to bring the big luggage so i can start packing" second message "Can you use the actuary the mediator recommended to get your pensiion valuation because we arent going to get it on time and separation agreement wont be readiy by house closing"
STBXW Replies : "From now on dont send me these messages. Its been a year and a half since we split up. Please only message me if its in regards to the house or finalizing the divorce. If you are having a hard time please reach out to a friend or your conselor. Thank you"
Now this message seems heavily coached, and i wouldnt be suprised if shes been playing the victim card to new guy and he had a hand in crafting this message for her. Like this is how you deal with your troublesome ex.
This kind of stuff is infuriating to me. Ive been trying to get her to either work on marriage or sell the house last year and since march of last year ive been trying to sell the house so i can move on. Ive had agreement papers thrown in my face to sell house. Ive had 3 month delay on destroying embryos. Delays on mediation documentation, now shes delaying taking her things from the house. At this point house closes by end of June and shes barely taken anything from the home. Im now considering getting the lawyer involved as its becoming ridiculous that i feel im dealing with a child. Shes skiritng her responsibilities and if this house isnt clear by closing we are liable to being sued by buyers.
Just the sheer audacity to send a message like that to me.
She probably is being coached by someone...
Doesn't really matter though , in the long run.
The analogy that I've always used is that the WAS anger is like the boosters on the Space Shuttle...
You know, they have the auxiliary fuel tanks strapped to their side during take off, and once they get to a cruising altitude the tanks drop off...and the flight gets much smoother..
Anger is much the same....
Anger is severe whenever there is a "push away" from the spouse...
She needs much more fuel to push away from you, her old life, her demons in her head....
She needs more fuel to justify getting a Divorce, which i'm certain at some point, she swore she would never do....
She needs you to be this person to justify her decision to leave...
She needs you to react the same way that she pictures you in her head....
She needs you to be that person so that she can look at said friends and say...see ??
Because how dare you be different ?
How dare you not be the person that she has described ??
As far as her belongings ?
She knows the dates, she knows the deal....
You can't fix or change it for her.
It's either out by the date ....or it's in a dumpster before the date.
A former wise poster here gave me some great advice a while back....
Every time they hit you with a load of bullschidt....
Hit them back with a load of reality...
Stay your course, because that is who you want to be...
Yes, W is dragging her feet. She’s not embracing responsibility. Not really new, is it?
Her response to your two messages is likely coached. Oh well. Doesn’t matter. Gives her someone else to blame (other than you and especially herself ) when/if things go awry. The whole not embracing responsibility theme she’s got going on.
You asked. She responded. And not too favourably for getting things done.
First off, go buy yourself some new luggage. I’m guessing your separation agreement doesn’t spell out who owns the luggage. If she has it, let it be her’s. Don’t sweat the small stuff, you got enough on your plate.
The house is sold. Closes end of June.
Originally Posted by Catman19
“Can you use the actuary the mediator recommended to get your pension valuation because we arent going to get it on time and separation agreement wont be ready by house closing”
Yes, time is ticking by. I’d speak with your lawyer about a couple of things.
If her not providing documentation is going to derail the house sale or the separation process. Also get legal proceedings started to ensure she complies if required. See what needs to happen to ensure the sale.
It does sound like the house sale is happening regardless.
Originally Posted by Catman19
if this house isn't clear by closing we are liable to being sued by buyers.
W might get her act together. Or might show up on hour elven with OM and a bunch of his friends and toss her stuff in the pack of some pick-up trucks. Or she might completely flake out. Speak with your L and see how these scenarios affect you, legally. Can you be sued? What are your options if so?
I’d run this idea by your lawyer, and if ok be prepared to do so. A week before closing (or even now if L says it’s ok), rent a storage shed. Move her stuff into it. Pay the storage rent for one month past the closing date. Have L send her the key and a letter telling her where her stuff is. Wash your hands of her stuff and her irresponsibly towards the sale.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Yeah I'm basically communicating with lawyer now and seeing what my options are. The luggage thing doesn't bother me its a minor trade considering im letting her take all the electronics and furniture. My biggest concern isnifnseparation isnt done by junen28th the proceeds of home sale get held in trust and it delays my one way trip. I sense she is trying tonexert whatever control she thinks she has over me or is purposely trying to frustrate me to get a reaction. All this does for me tbh is to be more resolved in taking the path ive decided to take
The more her mask slips off the more i know im making the right choice
Sidenote : just picked up book meditations, based on the writings of marcus aurelius Great book so far, teaches one to take on stoicism traits and focus on ones self
Hey Catman. I am just catching up on many other situations. I recommend leveraging your attorney at this point. As others say and you seem to recognize, the luggage isn't a worthwhile hill to die on. The pension valuation is a different and more significant matter, much like the house. I'm not sure about your location, but the legal divorce process in my state starts to eliminate opportunities for any party to drag their feet for too long. They want most divorces done in under a year, drive couples to mediation (including having independent appraisers and actuaries involved if necessary) early in the process, and judges expect a draft settlement well before one year from the filing date. Let the process take over here to get these things done and shift the pressure to your W so that you no longer need to reach out to her. Maybe I'm misunderstanding where things are at in your situation and need to re-read the thread.
I'd also add that her response to your text is odd. I don't see you reaching out to her for comfort or contact. You were trying to conduct business (aside from the luggage request perhaps). Turning things over to let the D process run its course has been one of the best actions for me and gotten my W to see 1) problems still happen for her when I'm less involved and 2) the reality of what divorce is likely to bring is less rosy than the fantasy.
Best wishes on all of this. Meditations is great BTW!
Last edited by MrP; 05/09/2402:05 AM. Reason: Correcting some typos.
Thanks mr P Yeah im approaching the finish line and ive already consulted lawyer, mediator, real estate lawyer and even if stuff is not done on time i can do it all from across the ocean. For me now its more to cut all ties and get money from home sale. I have the legal leverage rn, juet avoiding using lawyer too much if not necessary. Trying my best to be civil and project what she might do so i can act accordingly. I gave myself 5 weeks vacation preceding closing of house so if she doesnt do things as she needs to im capable of dealing with the logistics with plenty of time. I am just not in the mood to be doing her responsibilities for her. Pension valuation i can pay out of pocket for her valiation through actuary if need be but i dont want to give her any copouts or do any of the lifting for her. Her text response imo is purely her showing her new man that shes a victim I can read her like a book now and i still have access to one of her social media accounts which she has no clue about, which is helping me read the situation better. Shes just trying to manipulate as much as she can and her mask slips a lot more easily now. It seems to me she wants to exert control still even at this stage.
STBXW Replies : "From now on dont send me these messages. Its been a year and a half since we split up. Please only message me if its in regards to the house or finalizing the divorce. If you are having a hard time please reach out to a friend or your conselor. Thank you"
Filter heavily. I translate messages like that to this:
STBXW Replies : "From now on dont send me these messages. Its been a year and a half since we split up. Please only message me if its in regards to the house or finalizing the divorce. If you are having a hard time please reach out to a friend or your conselor. Thank you"[/quote]
Every message you send should start like:
"To help ensure the divorce is finalized on time" then add the specifices such as " , XY and Z are needed" "To help ensure the house sells by " then add the specifices.
One of the best things I learned was this :
"If I don't hear back from you by "this date" I will do "this action".
as well as giving two choices:
"To help ensure the house sells on time, I have boxed up your things. Let me know what day you would like to pick them up and I will leave them on the porch. If I don't hear from you by next friday, I will donate them to goodwill. Regards, CatMan"
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Has anyone ever considered how big of a roll personality disorders play in these situations. Like all of the stories seem the same here, build up a good life, everything seems fine for a while, hit a rough patch in the relationship and the person bails for reasons that dont seem logical or worthy of breaking up a marriage and family. Is it just possible that we are all empathetic people dealing with Cluster B personality disordered spouses? Is it just maybe possible while the DB strategy is great, working on yourself is great and improves ones own life, but if you are dealing with someone who sees the world in a self driven identity and perception of the world and relationships that maybe we are fighting against something that is changing us to be something for someone. While we are forgetting that we deserve happiness, respect, affection and compassion. Like at what point do we stop bending over backwards and dedicating our lives to someone who doesnt share the same values as us and lives their life with one goal and one sole purpose - to use others for their own personal gain without adequate compromise and selflessness.
Like all of these stories seem like we are dealing with either Bipolar or Narcissistic Personalities and we are trying to force someone to be something they cannot be, a personality disorder makes someone who they are this way for life, while we can conform and contort to please them, they dont see reality as we do - with empathy and kindness. Could it just be that tbey try to conform to what theyve been taught and what they see as being normal and approved by society, but they are really not being themselves and pretending to be someone they are not, and eventually they get tired of faking the characteristics that make us good human beings, and they give up and do what they feel and what they want to make themselves happy. No matter if its at someone elses expense and even at the expense of their lifelong well being. These people are disorderly and they sometimes need a trigger to be who they are, be it mid life, post partum, social media, bad friends and enablers.
I think sometimes we are not meant to be with people who dont love us as we deserve to be loved.
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