Grief and Gratitude, Grok - Shifting

[grok]

Returning home

As DnJ said

Quite enjoyable.

And also, nice to be back home.

My work trip last week went well and was socially fun with the others.

While I was driving to lunch with three other men in the car one day I got a call from D17. I messaged I can’t talk but she kept calling. It turned out W was there with a flat tire. D17 was changing it. She called looking for some of the tools and some advice. Well… she got good advice from all the men in the car…LOL. They thought is was awesome that D17 was taking charge and doing the job. They all wondered what the heck W was doing/not doing. And why W wasn’t using the roadside service # that I paid for with the original warranty purchase. I have no idea and didn’t ask.

I arrived back home Friday evening and loved on the kids. I waited until the next morning late to ask for their help in household pickup/cleanup that didn’t happen while I was gone. A reset relax day plus back to school shopping for D17 and S12 supplies with D19 advising. Picked up burrito supplies for dinner we all helped make.

Sunday… ooof. up, animals, make some breakfast things, herd them out the door for church, 79c Slushies for all on the way home, make lunch, NAP. 2:30p…. No more time for resting. S12 and I head out for groceries and supplies for the week. D19 and D17 go out for shirts and dress shopping. Back home and then take D17 to practice driving. Make dinner things, We all make next day lunch things, loose at connect 4 game to D17, kitchen cleanup, animals, get ready for bed time. Whew!

I noticed I feel a bit irritated when the kids are at home spending happy time with W. Why? I’m not sure. It feels like ignoring this destruction and treating it like W expressed once, ”The parenting class told me we’re still family, we just have two separate homes.”

A conversation before my travel
Alt title - On why I mentioned her the rowboat in the storm and me attempting to be the lighthouse

W came over early in the evening while I was eating a salad D17 and I made.

W, ”Can I talk to you without the children please?”
G, ”Sure, let’s go outside.”

W, ”Are you considering asking for 100% custody? Have you considered it? I wanted to ask because I can tell when people are lying.”
G, pause, think, ”No. I have not considered sole custody. I’m not keeping the kids from you.”

I did NOT voice any of my speculative considered options. I have not considered sole custody because her behavior so far and the kids living with me did not raise those concerns. I have, however, been aware of her behaviors and have my thresholds where I would be concerned.

W, ”THEY have been psychologically attacking me. Their techniques work even when I know they are techniques… Telling me I’ll be considered I’m an unfit parent and lose my kids.”.

She starts weeping gently. I have no reason to believe it isn’t genuinely what she believes and feels.

”G, that is the one thing that would break me. … THEY sabotaged my water, it’s why I permanently lost running water in my RV. My job cleaning the RV park facilities has been interfered with and vandalized. THEY have caused me trouble all over the county. THEY call themselves Christians…when they are not Christian like at all. G, be careful who you tell things to. ”

G, I listened with full attention. No other expressions than focused attention. ”OK W. …. and… You know… I’ve said… whatever is on paper, I’m not keeping the children from you. “

W nods and departs.

Backstory gleaned from conversations with W - THEY refers to OM’s circle of friends/acquaintances who were not part of the initial seduction game. When THEY found out what was really going on … all were upset with her and have been persecuting her ever since. On social media and the real world. How much is true reality? I don’t know.

I reflected none of my internal commentary…. The children are NOT a tool for me.

This is the only place I vent this. It would not be helpful. Vindictive/angry parts of me felt -
- what did you expect passive aggressively attempting the destruction of two families?
- Chasing an EA, divorce, in hopes OM would kick his wife to the curb is unfit parenting,
- how dumb are you (she is not BTW) to think there is such a thing permanent running water loss in an RV? It is just plumbing in ground or vehicle.
- It’s not within Christian principles to do what you are doing.
- Of all the people in this world, you should know me better than to think I carelessly or vindictively tell people things.

Compassionate me had me wondering about detachment -
- I am grieved W is under this pressure. It still hurts to see.
- thinking your children will be taken from you by a court …. … no words.
- I could fix plumbing… no, I’m not going to.
- genuine tears/pain make me want to hold her. Then I think no, she wants OM to hold her.


Redemption Song by Apollo LTD

Everybody's got a story
And here's a little bit of mine
Took a prodigal fall from glory
'Til I finally saw the light
…
This is my redemption song
My heart cries hallelujah
Who I was is dead and gone
And the old me's looking new, yeah
You filled my soul with melodies
Heaven won't stop singing over me
I'm a child of God and I belong
This is my redemption song

Now I've got a hope and future
This is what freedom's like
I'm running to a new tomorrow
And I'm leaving yesterday behind

g

[Catman19]

Stay strong grok, i know this isnt easy and you are an amazing example for your children. Me thinks W is going through paranoia stage as at this stage they think everyone is out to get them because the guilt and shame is starting to sit heavy on her. As much as she tries to put on a facade of being in a better place the infatuation stage of OM has begun to lose its lustre. I seen you are practicing stoicism for yourself and it seems to be paying off. Your children will see that you are there for them and that is where your emotional energy should be focused. Keep it up and eventually you will realize what your worth is and your children will acknowledge that.

[grok]

The End of All Things

Oh, Those playlist items on the way in to work...has me in a contemplative mood... (or melancholy is a secondary trait of mine)

overcoming the challenges, the changes in you, and the cost...

Snips (from web sites) representing my incomplete train of thoughts. the echos of changes in ourselves in this trauma.

The End of all Things - Lord of the Rings: Return of the King (soundtrack)

The End of All Things is the fifty-seventh scene
...
Sam half-dragging Frodo out through the doorway. They find a raised boulder for what they believe will be their final respite. Frodo, no longer weighed down with the burden of the Ring, exclaims "It's done". He lays down, with a sea of molten lava surrounding them, and closes his eyes.
...
Themes
...
A theme of The Lord of the Rings is the deep cost for the characters to protect the people and places they love, and how they will be forever changed despite the victory.
...
Aragorn has spent the series avoiding his destiny and the film’s ending shows what beautiful things can happen when someone decides to become who they were meant to be.
...
The four main hobbits...they have been changed greatly by their journey while their home and those closest to them have remained largely unchanged and ignorant of the dangers they narrowly avoided. For the longest time, the hobbits were out of their element, away from Hobbiton, but being back, they again find themselves out of place.
...
The things that they used to mind don’t seem to matter as much...much of what they have seen and learned lingers over them
...
Frodo speaks rhetorically to himself about what it means to move on when others can't move with you.
...
the price it cost means that he can no longer be a part of this world. Frodo saves Middle-earth for everyone at the cost of saving himself.
...
about a traumatic journey into dark and cruel places, and the difficulty that comes with trying to rebuild a normal life on the other side.
...
is about picking up the pieces after failure, about trying even when there is no hope of success
...
“How do you pick up the threads of an old life, when in your heart, you know there is no going back?”
...
The Story will go on...

in a moment of abject despair, Sam had cradled Frodo’s nearly lifeless body and whispered, “Don’t leave me alone. Don’t go where I can’t follow.”
...
Sam never left Frodo’s side, never lost faith in him, never left him behind. Now Frodo is leaving him for good, and he can never follow ... In the end, the true final scene ... It’s hardly even a scene. Sam walks home, turning Frodo’s words over and over in his mind. “Your part in the story will go on….you will have to be one and whole for many years.”

g

[Kind18]

It’s not within Christian principles to do what you are doing.

These sorts of thoughts are a waste of time.

Assuming that she should have better moral standards because of her religion is a cheeseless tunnel.

Aetheists do good things, and bad things.

Christians do good things, and bad things.

During the initial stages of my separation, my ex wife would take the children on her weekend and sit in church singing and praying - while she was actively having an affair.

I think overall you handled the interaction very well.

The person you thought you knew doesn’t exist. Either never did, or is missing in action (likely for many years).

Set your expectations of her very, very low - it makes your life easier.

The only person whose thoughts and behaviours and morality you control - are yours!

[grok]

Frist! (old internet joke)

Hey everyone! Happy to see the site back up and new certs in place.

Now to write all those things I've been thinking all week without posting.

g

[grok]

Hi Kind18,

Thanks for bombing the forums from/with experience. heh, not sarcasm. I learn or get re-enforcement on better behaviors and approaches for me from each one.

STORM and RAIN

The kids and I are drying out after storm Debby passed by. Unfortunately the county had closed the parks and preserves or we would have gone out playing in the rain.

We almost didn't go out at all because D17 and D19 had a bit of a brief emotional blowout (sisters close in age, quite different personallities, it is gonna happen) ending with D17 walking away with "really, f-you!" THAT was a step to far and I stepped in. " Go to your rooms, NOW. Time for you both to cool off." I closed their doors.

Man up G, W is gone and you are IT. How the *** do I handle female sibling conflict?

I talked to each after 10 minutes. Both of them got "I'm not going to solve your conflict. I do require you to apologize to her for your over-the-top attitude. We are NOT going out until that happens. " From each I received a litany of "but" and "just" and "she did x" and ... For each I said, "yes, that may be true. If you would like, later, I can give you each of your "but" "just" "she did x" and show how you both did wrong. That is not what I asked for." I closed their doors.

It took another 20 minutes before they were ready. I busied myself with other things until they each came by with some form of "I said sorry for the over-the-top. But NOT what SHE did. Can we go out now?" Ha! "Yes, we can go now. Thank You for apologizing for the over-the-top."

It was fun playing frisbee in the pouring rain in the street. LOL S12, D17, D19 and I were all laughing in the rain.

Oh, and S12 and I had to take the dogs for their evening walk (no peeing in the house pls) in POURING rain at 10pm because it wasn't letting up. We decided to forgo umbrellas and raincoats and just be soaked. The dogs loved/hated it and got frisky. We needed five towels.

THAT spouse is gone and cheeseless tunnels

These sorts of thoughts are a waste of time.

Assuming that she should have better moral standards because of her religion is a cheeseless tunnel.

Agreed! Though sometimes hard to get myself out of the instinctual response. I let myself think and feel it as it occurs...then toss it away as useless. Sometimes vent here just to let it out and then drop it. I've gotten better at it over time. There is so much more worthy of my time and energy than running down those tunnels.

During the initial stages of my separation, my ex wife would take the children on her weekend and sit in church singing and praying - while she was actively having an affair.

This was one of the things that surprised me the most in the last 18 months. Reading and learning on affairs and so on...that experts claimed no significant difference across various beliefs or value systems.

For me a related experience... In church the Pastor announcing communion "We are told not to take this unless your heart is right with God, if you are not, just sit it out this month. There is no judgement here," with W sitting next to me, drowning deep in her EA, saying, "I feel I'm right with God, but I won't take it because I don't want to be a stumbling block to others" seemingly referring to D19 and D17.

I think overall you handled the interaction very well.

Thank you for the feedback. It is difficult to see when in the middle of it.

The person you thought you knew doesn’t exist. Either never did, or is missing in action (likely for many years).

Set your expectations of her very, very low - it makes your life easier.

Based on conversations this last 18 months and debris I have been cleaning up in the home...I think MIA for 3 or 4 years now. I think her retirement from the military reserves on a low note ~ six years ago started the process.

Most of the time zero expectations is the norm now. A big assist from going dark/dim. As others have noted, going dark/dim turns out to be for me, to reset and center myself.

The only person whose thoughts and behaviours and morality you control - are yours!

An ongoing work to never end!

g

[grok]

feelings

I mean who did he think he was 2yrs ago saying ILYBINILWY...as if. Does H think that in the 32yrs of marriage I haven't had the same feelings? You know what you do you fight through those feelings cause they do pass.
Sorry I know that's random. From time to time I think abt things that were said and I think, As If. Certain things stick out the most,
...
I could go on and on but I won't bore y'all. I'm sure yall have heard similar things.

https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2950239#Post2950239

THIS and yes, I have heard similar things.

It ties in with quotes I posted from Zues126, from GK Chesterton, with the notion that Love not just feelings, or a verb, but is also a Choice.

on "OM/OW is a symptom"

guys who will go and blame the guys their gf/wife cheated on them with. Not realising the gf/wife is the problem not the enabler. The other guy was just there to pop their ego investment bubble.

However, their cognitive dissonance and the feelings for their gf/wife blind them.

The guy she cheated with was just the messenger.

Even if the guy was not in the picture the problem was already there, and she just needed a trigger.
... ...
Instead, you should thank the guy she cheated on you with because then you know who you are truly dealing with, not blame him.

Now you are free.

Lick the wounds your ego suffered, cut your losses from your misplaced investments and understand that the world is at it is not as you wish it to be.

I would say free to Stand or Leave or ?, seeing the world and spouse as it is, not as you wish it or him/her to be. The problems with ME and HER were already there. What you choose is about who YOU are. I did put this on Whatlee's thread but it follows here...

IMO standing is an essential part of the healing process of the LBS. You will constantly questions this throughout. At least I have up to this point.

You will ask yourself questions like "WTF am I doing this for this person?"

In the beginning we want answers.

...

Then you realize that this is part of YOU

What you have chosen is part of YOU and your character. So what began out of a search for answers for why and what is wrong with you. Out of hurt for what someone did to you...

You see it all has to do with who YOU are. The best part of who YOU are and then...

It is no longer about what THEY choose or why.

It is about YOU

Click the link, read the rest.
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2010045#Post2010045

Previous conversation coda

W inserted this anomaly, for her, into the conversation

"G, You know I would be OK with putting the kids into a school if they ever showed signs of interest. but they haven't. "

I said nothing but acknowledged her statement. This is the first thought of non-homeschooling expressed to me in over a decade. W was upset with me saying in mediation we should have a clause that lets us jointly consider schooling options on a yearly basis rather than legally locking in only homeschool.

Something for the LBS -

Lesser Loves
from Lamentations: Simple Songs of Lament and Hope
by Bifrost Arts

I was an orphan, but You called me "child"
I was a stranger; I was lost and defiled,
Redemption found me from up above
O how I had settled for lesser loves.

(refrain)
How can I thank you, Lord?
My broken heart, You have restored.
How can I thank you, Lord?
You give me grace I cannot afford.

g

[grok]

Well, It's been a week. I SEE you all.

I keep having half formed posts written in my head. and then real life means kids and GAL comes first. I did find in the old posts how people met outside the DB site. Minor bits of cleverness...making an account using the username here as a username in that social network ... book of faces. First or last name playing on DB. You can find me there.

Public/State school has started here, the roads are a mess, and schedules for activities have all changed. D17's gymnastics schedule changed to evenings now. S12 and D17 both have all day Tuesday home-school coop day now. Monday night activities are S12's scout like troop for a couple hours and then making lunch/school prep with D17 and S12 for the next day.

gratitude
Last night, after work, I got home and helped S12 finish making the mac-n-cheese that was on the stove. STBXW had just arrived to drop S12 off and started it. I made some "pigs-in-a-blanket" for when D17 and D19 got home. Then I went out to my now regular Tuesday trivia night at the pub ... taking a bowl of PiaB with me for my regular crew to snack on. Some got eaten and some did not, but I got smiles all around, which felt good. They asked where kids were this week (sometimes they stop by and join in for 30 minutes, for me to buy them sodas and sandwiches).

F, who I got to know first at the pub, asked me how I was doing and told me off to the side that he and his W, J, had discussed splitting. They hadn't so far...kids and all. My words to him were "you don't stay together for the kids...that is the wrong frame...you repair the broken bits in your relationship for the kids and yourself." He expressed compliments on how I was handling it and the kids.

At the end of trivia when we were saying goodbyes (We WON, $50 gift card), J, his wife, came over, gave me a hug, and said "we love you. we think you are doing an amazing job." I was not expecting that.

grief
After one of the rounds I picked up my phone and saw W had called twice, messaged, and D17 had called. Messages showed "can you pick D17 up?" "hello?" "never mind" "Ms. S is taking D17 home" I tried to call D17 since I was a 5-minute drive from her gymnastics.

she messaged back.

"mama forgot me"

"I have a ride home"

G, "hugs"

D17, hugs emoji

From the security cams I saw W stopped by home for 10 minutes right about when D17 got dropped off.

When I got home I asked D17 where her school tote was. It has what she needs to work on for the rest of the week.

D17, "I don't know dad. I think mama forgot to leave it. It must be in her car."
G, "OK. We'll figure it out tomorrow. It's time to walk the dogs and get ready for bed. Time to stop hitting your brother with pillows so he can get ready."

This morning I was out walking big dog at 0615 before sunrise. I see W's car zoom by...stop at the house...the doorbell sensor alerted on my phone...and a minute later she zooms back away. When I arrived home I see D17's school tote on the front porch. I guess D17 complained ... STBXW? ... I guess those emotions are putting plenty of pressure on her so she delivered before dawn without a word.

g

PS. Karma Fields. I had been trying to remember this artist. They stuck in my mind because of the interesting visuals generated from the music properties.

.me by Karma Fields
[Intro]
I'm just trying to figure myself out
Trying to pick up somehow

[Verse 1]
Parts of me
Pieces of memories
Feels like everything's moving
I don't know where it's going

Wish I could see the light in me
Where I should put my feet to move ahead
I'll go anywhere

[Bridge]
I'm just trying to figure myself out
Trying to figure myself out

[grok]

A few days ago from STBXW I received a lengthy text message with a screenshot of a medical bill text for D17. Summarized -

- image is supposed to be for D17
- I click and follow but it shows no account for D17
- I haven't gotten reminders for supposed bill for two months
- I'm sure it was paid by you or me or reimbursed
- I got this today
- I don't know if it is legitimate because
- THEY have been perpetrating money fraud to punish me for 16 months
- I tried D17's birth date and it said no account
- I tried S12's birth date and it said no account
- I refuse to call because people will say anything
- If you want, I can go in person
- I don't mind doing that in case it is real

Yes, she has always had a LOT of words. I had always found it endearing.

On the people "THEY" she thinks are persecuting her for the EA+? I don't know. I do know she spent $7,000 extra in the month before I took joint credit cards back. She spent ~$7,000+ on her own credit card before claiming fraud charges. She moved to a debit card and then claimed fraud/hacking a couple months later. The woman I knew before is very smart but inexperienced in finance/money.

I just replied, after 24 hours, "That sounds frustrating. I will take care of **medical company**"

I attempted to validate the feelings expressed between the lines and take on what is my responsibility. I STFU about anything else.

The medical insurance and payments for the kids are my responsibility. I paid the bill when I knew there was one. She took them in for some visits this year but I don't think she tracked anything.

g

[DnJ]

Good Morning g

Nicely done distilling down STBXW’s text to the medical/business matters that you should look into. Your 24 hour delayed response was succinctly to the point.

I agree, there is some emotions between the lines, as well as some baiting/fishing for you to latch onto. Good steering clear of all that.

It’s unfortunate Mom let slide picking up D17 from gymnastics. Sounds like Daughter took it in stride and simply found an alternate ride. It’s times like these when one realizes how much their children have grown, matured, and become responsible. Basically, how well they are healing. The same scenario a year ago would have triggered quite a less calm, taken in stride, result.

Hope you and your brood have a great weekend!

D