Yes, you're right. I'm such a fool. In ALL my posts over the past 3 months I have been only focused on being 'right'. In fact being 'right' is all that matters to me. I guess I learned nothing useful by this experience except that I should not trust my instincts or experiences when in any situation involving drugs. Luckily I only live 4 blocks from the hospital so there's a good chance nobody will die because of my stupidity.
Frank, that whole paragraph is over the top and sarcastic.
Grow up.
Is this how you interact with people when they disagree with your opinion? Dumb question I guess because obviously you're so doing. A different viewpoint, express an opinion you don't like, and look how you respond!
Very controlling to be so sarcastic, you know. But you don't control me, Frank.
May I ask how you've treated your wife when she ever expressed differences in opinions with you? I know you've mentioned she had a problem asserting herself (Hmmm) - but I don't. So if you've treated your wife without being sarcastic or dramatic, then treat me the same way, I'm a person too, and I'd deem it respectful and mature if you did. Thanks.
does anyone have any comments to my W's reactions and feelings this morning? I kinda would like some feedback on that.
OK. I hear what she said when she thought she needed help and I hear what she told you this morning. I also have just gotten a few tastes of how you react, and knowing just a bit about your sitch based on what you've posted, factoring it all in, my take is I think she's swallowing any hurt she felt over the neglect she perceived and is trying to keep peace with you and blaming herself for her own normal reaction of last night's concerns. I also think she's going to tell someone else how she really feels.
It may be a good idea for the two of you to open up about this with your counselor.
Sorry it doesn't agree with yours about being a "white knight in shining armor" in her eyes, but hey, you wanted feedback.
Is this how you interact with people when they disagree with your opinion? Dumb question I guess because obviously you're so doing. A different viewpoint, express an opinion you don't like, and look how you respond!
No it isn't how I interact with people who constructively disagree with my opinions. But, I let myself get angry by the sarcastic remarks like 'You're a doctor? Then OK. 'You're a psychiatrist too? Then OK' and "And a lawyer? Wow.' in a previous post. I interpreted them as hurtful to me.
I should have been a better man and let it roll off me. But I didn't, I let it get under my skin. Big mistake. For that I am truly sorry. I have been through a lot of complex emotional stuff in the past 24 hours so I can forgive myself for getting into 'it' with NYsurvivor.
And no, I don't treat my Wife that way because she doesn't treat me that way.
Fellow DB'ers, I'm sorry I reacted, but I guess I was too highly emotional this morning. Too late to delete the posts so I'll just move on.
Frank_D: You handled that situation just fine. I actually have a history of unusual heart palpitations that are brought on by NOTHING, they can hit me in a dead sleep and last for up to 14 hours. 15 minutes of a slightly rapid heartbeat is nothing, believe me. And that is also confirmed by Cardiologists I have seen. All the symptoms that signal danger in my case, are the same ones that you were looking for and did not see. You did fine.
There is a much bigger story here. You were indeed given a unique insight into just how she used to feel. It stunned you. It brought you to tears and you finally, truly understood the damage you caused in your drinking days. THAT is priceless. So often our remorse is only triggered by the emotions that we see in our loved ones, but mostly it is triggered by what we ourselves lose. You have been where I have been. I understand what you mean. It's an all new kind of regret when the shoe is really on the other foot. Not everyone gets that experience so don't forget it. It was given to you for a purpose. One day you will know why. Maybe soon, maybe not.
Your wife is still so confused. I see that at times you two share such tenderness. Know that no one else is going to know her like you do. Not even massage boy across the country. He only knows her in her confusion. I really hope she can scale this wall in front of her. You two could be in such a better place...
Wow! Frank, I don't know if you handled the situation "just right" but I have done similar things in the past for almost the same exact reasons, and in the morning, or the next day, my wife reacted the same way (she has panic attacks and often feels like she needs to go to the hospital but almost never does). I don't know if there is a switch that has been thrown in NYS but one of the better, more constructive posters here has taken to being pretty judgmental and sarcastic. NYS, it's not that we can't handle diverse opinions, it's how those opinions are presented that seems to be in question. I know on my, and Tim's threads you have done similar things today. I understand you have some different things you want to express, but on a site that so far, has been really supportive, EVEN when being contrary, it is out of place. I welcome your input because on the whole it has been constructive (and you HAVE not always agreed with me or sugar coated your comments) and not judgmental or sarcastic. Just my two cents.
frank, I agree with Amy and I think, although NYS is being somewhat harsh, he does make valid point. You are not alone in always wanting to be right. I have struggled with this all my life and it just got worse the older I got. Now I see it adn most of the time, and this is true DBing applied to life, I just let things go and agree. The other day I got my hair done. Now my barber likes to talk, push peoples buttons, and make a lot of erroneous statements which I do not agree with. In the past this would lead me to get up on my soapbox and speak. This time I just agreed, had fun with it, and let him run with it. It was entertaining to say the least and I practiced my agreeing. At one point I actually got him to agree that he was wrong, without him realizing it . In a way, this is much more enjoyable than argueing.
As for your Ws actions this morning, I would say she is full of guilt and confused. Use these opportunities to plant the seeds of doubt as per the D. "Honey, I just want you to know that I will be here for you when we are Ded. At least as long as I am single...then who knows". You must show her you are ok with a D. Turn the tables on her. You already have with the finances.
You really had some excellent advice, and I am so, so , so incrediable greatful right now. Especially after today (read my thread if you want details).
H is depressed. He has said so. He has told his mother he is tired of being uphappy. However, H pins all his unhappiness to me. Claims it is what caused the A, causes him to go out and drink. While I feel some responsiability for his uphappiness, I truly do not feel I deserve this, nor is everything my fault. Is this typical of an alcoholic- to blame other people?
This is H 2nd DUI, and he does seem generally remorseful. Knows how incrediably badly he screwed up. Probably didn't need to hear me say he was worthless and a horrible father today... ouch. Not to proud of myself there. I could have showed more compassion, tried not to give into the anger. But I'm tired at this point.. so tired.
Am concerned I am pushing him into even a deeper depression at this point, with my harsh word, threats, boundaries. But I don't know how to "toe the line" between enabling and making sure I maintain my self respect. I would hate to abandon him as he is sinking in an even deeper depression, but am afraid I am contributing to it, and am afraid of being taking down by it as well (if not already).
I just don't know what to do. He has seemed to indicate (pre-DUI) that his life would be better without me in it. He could go out and party and live his life without and constraints on his freedom.
At all just confusing. H has not had a drink since last Sunday to my knowledge. I am trying to keep in mind what you said- the first few weeks are the most difficult. Hoping today's major backslide will not cause irreversiable damage between H and I. I noticed in my H in the past, the "shakes" , when he did not have a drink over the course of a couple days; haven't seen that so far, but have not seen H much since the either.
Anyways, I appreciate the advice. I have no experience in how to deal with an alcoholic, and I am so angry with him rigth now that I don't know that I should stay in this environment. It's not good for him and its not good for me.
Sounds like you had an intersting night the other night....
PF
PetiteFlower
Quote: Follow Your Bliss
~Joseph Campbell
Have you ever thought about going to an AA meeting? I know that they welcome family members to them, and can be very helpful and supportive in situations like yours. It's just a thought.
Most of us really marry only once. First love endures, even unto our dying day. And we never really divorce.
The thought has crossed my mind. I'm not sure. Thinking maybe a therpist instead. Or maybe both... if I can get H to stay home regularly with S3 once a week...
I appreciate the suggestion. It would probably give me some insights on how to deal with an alcoholic. Thank you.
PetiteFlower
Quote: Follow Your Bliss
~Joseph Campbell
Quote: There is a much bigger story here. You were indeed given a unique insight into just how she used to feel. It stunned you. It brought you to tears and you finally, truly understood the damage you caused in your drinking days. THAT is priceless. So often our remorse is only triggered by the emotions that we see in our loved ones, but mostly it is triggered by what we ourselves lose. You have been where I have been. I understand what you mean. It's an all new kind of regret when the shoe is really on the other foot. Not everyone gets that experience so don't forget it. It was given to you for a purpose. One day you will know why. Maybe soon, maybe not.
(tears in my eyes right now) Yes Amy, I knew you would see it too. I have to stop typing as I sob right now...
... I'm back. I've been doing this all day, sobbing uncontrollably from time to time. You're so right, I was given the opportunity to be in her shoes, and she in mine. Of all the things she could do on a 'friday the 13th', she digs out some brownies from the freezer that have been there for a couple YEARS, and were pretty much forgotten because we really didn't care to use them. She already had an open bottle of wine in the fridge and she could have had a glass of that instead. But she didn't.
And she said she wanted 'to feel better', the same thing I would say when drinking. Exactly the same.
And it makes her sick, and I have to take care of her, and she resents it and resents me while it's happening. And I sit around with nothing to do, waiting to make sure she really is 'all right'. And the next morning she comes to me to show remorse for putting ME through this. All this is just like I would have done.
What is going on?
All the time I pray for help getting through this, and for her eyes to be opened. I pray for my family to be healed and together again.
I'm hoping she heard me when I said "I am terrified when I think of ever being the way I was ever again. I just can't be that way again. I am so so sorry, I never knew how you felt, watching someone you love hurt themselves and not being able to do anything about it." And then I cried for her, for the hurt. I hope she heard the words and felt the feelings.
Quote: Your wife is still so confused. I see that at times you two share such tenderness. Know that no one else is going to know her like you do. Not even massage boy across the country. He only knows her in her confusion. I really hope she can scale this wall in front of her. You two could be in such a better place...
Thanks Amy. From the inside I don't always see it. And it's really hurting today. I KNOW that our problems were not all my fault, but this part of our problems ARE, and I 'get it' completely now.
I just don't know how she could ever trust enough and love me enough to want to try again. I just keep thinking that the more she sees of this 'exposing' of the hurt, the more she will be convinced she is doing the right thing. And the 'in love' feelings she has for OM, whatever they may be, have got to get her thinking that even if OM doesn't work out, she can find happiness somewhere else, rather than risk the things she would risk with me. I guess I am a pessimist today.
I know I'll be ok. I know I'm getting back to my normal, very capable self. It's just that being there for my daughters AND for W is so heavy sometimes.
Last nite and today were a great gift. What will be next?
. In a way, this is much more enjoyable than argueing. 
