Friday we went to see the MC to see if we can maybe start off going in a different direction, I kind of suggested the SBT way to the MC. We informed him that we kind of know what we want to do, and we just need for him to help us move forward. The MC asked my wife how involved is she with the OM, W replied they mostly talk (I still have to be convinced). She still talks to OM, email, phone probably when at work. I on the other hand am still DBing. It's tough, when I'm home and W is on the computer, I do the "AS IF". W is still curious as to what I'm doing, I guess that's a good thing.
MC had brought up this story about 2 dogs, and W has a bag of food only enough to feed 1 dog. She knows she can only feed one dog and without food the other has to die. W revised this story and made it 2 dogs and a puppy. Now W had included our son in the story. She openly said that "off course I have to pick my family", but how long is she going to sit on the fence and watch us dogs drool?
On a lighter note, she had already asked me about plans for our anniversary. We're going out of town for a week. I never really proposed to her to marry me, it just kind of happened when she found out she was pregnant. I'm thinking of getting another set of rings, cheesy as it may sound, as as symbol of starting over fresh.
That's all for now... thank you for reading and I hope you all the best in your pursuit of happiness.
I think I made a major mistake of answering a question my W asked me about the book I was reading, His Needs, Her Needs. I mentioned the part about surviving an A. The part that if the WS doesn't agree to ending contact with OP then it might call for a temporary separation.
Do I let her go on her own for now or do I just tough it out and may the best man win? If I let her stay I know she is safe and that's one thing less for me to worry about even though I know W and OM still email and talk on the phone. Right now, W is a little quiet because of our talk about possible temporary separation.
I'll keep this short this time because I have said it too many times before. I think we should ALL read as much as possible but there are just some things that don't go well together. DB is compatible with a LOT of other author's ideas about relationships and such but it does conflict with some also. I feel that any philosophy that advocates ultimatums and forcing the issue of an affair, conflicts with DB's more "hands off" approach. There are a LOT of people in the world who would call us crazy for doing what we do in DB but at least for me, it's worked. I "let" my W continue her affair and sure enough, it ended right around the 6 month mark, as predicted. Now, am I sure it's over? Nope, but I am sure that if I had "kicked her out" it would likely not be.
While it IS harder sometimes to have the WAS living with you, there are undeniable positives too. The biggest of which is that you get the chance to have daily, extended contact with the WAS so she can see the changes you are making. The obvious downside is that it's often MUCH harder to detach and make the necessary changes when she is right there in front of you, reminding you every minute of what is going on.
All I can say is that in DB/DR the idea is to stop focusing on the A, and yes, let it continue while you focus on yourself and making the changes that will have the greatest effect on you and your relationship.]
In the end, it's a decision you have to make, to ask her to leave, or get a temporary seperation. MANY people here have done that and it's worked for them while many others have made it work without doing that. Look at the situation, determine what's right for YOU and then move forward with it.
Thank you GH. I told the W even before checking the forum that I made up my mind and I don't want her to go anywhere. I told her it would be better for my son and I if she was around. I have DR on order and it should be here soon. I'm returning that other book back to the library.
Again, I want to be clear (because often I think I come across as some sort of dogmatic DBer) that reading other authors and learning as much as possible about our sitches is a GREAT thing but realize that most all of them will say that THEY are the right way to do things (as does DB for the most part, lol) and so you just have to try to find a set of guidelines, whether it be DB only, or some combonation of DB and something else, then stick with it. You just have to be careful that you aren't mixing stratageys that conflict with each other because not only will YOU get confused, but so will she, and not in that good "who is this GREAT man, and why did I stray from him" way.
The good news, AND bad news about DB is that it allows for and takes time. Sometimes it seems like there is no progress but usually that just means you are too focused on the relationship or your W and not on your own growth and changes.
Anyway, if you are looking to complement DB/DR, I can make a few suggestions that I think most here would support.
Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus - This is a "must read" as far as I am concerned. It's no good saving a marriage only to make the same "male" (or "female for that matter) all over again. This book can help you understand a lot about what you may have been doing wrong in your marriage simply because you didn't understand what your W was trying to tell you, and she didn't understand you either.
The 5 Love Languages - This is the other "must read". In this book, you learn about how different people communicate love in different ways. You learn about the 5 languages of love that according to the author, most people use to express their love to one another. It shows how people often express love in THEIR preferred way and not that of their partner, something that leads to one or both feeling unloved simply because they don't recognize the "type" of love being shown to them.
The Four Agreements - This one is kinda out there, but REALLY good at starting to get you to understand how to think on your own and not personalize things. I can't really explain this but it is a very highly regarded book for personal development. Check out a review before you buy this one to see if you think it would help.
The Little Book of Letting Go - This is simply a book that will help you understand how to let go of life's little nuisances and really enjoy the good parts of your day.
Passionate Marriage - I am still reading this one but it seems to be about how to be in a close, emotional relationship and still maintain "differentiation" or as we say around here, detachment. So far, it has done a GREAT job in helping me understand why detachment is SO important, even...especially in a GOOD relationship. It also goes into pretty graphic detail about sexual issues and techniques so it is more for the "piecing" part of the situation.
I hope this little list helps. If you are into audiobooks, I know that Mars/Venus and the Four Agreements are available that way.
W has been "silent" since last night. I told her last night about me making up my mind that I don't want a separation of any kind. I'm trying very hard not to do "mind reading" here, which is one of DONTs I've read about.
This morning, I did not even get a goodbye kiss from her when she went to work. Over the past week, she doesn't even miss one and when I move on to show I didn't expect her to, she gives me that body language to come on over.
I'm so confused right now. GH, from the start I stopped reading the other book halfway because DB just made more sense, but yesterday out of boredom and the heat in AZ I started reading where I left off and this is where it got me. The thing she said kept ringing in my head though, "it's not that bad", what's going on with our relationship. In a way it's not that bad, but sometimes I'm doubting myself how long I can tough it out, how long I can hold on.
I've transformed into a different person after reading DB, I don't I have even cried in front of her or begged or anything like that. Thanks to this website/forum where I read great advise from people who support each other. Reading the success stories brings tears to my eyes, I have to be really careful where I read it because sometimes it's just so touching, so touching it makes you just want to cry your eyes out.
Anyways, W, S8, and I are still on to watch a baseball game tonight. I am still hoping for a better outcome.
Please, keep doing that "hoping for a better outcome" all the while, being a GREAT dad for the kid(s).
As for her "silence", that's normal. We see all the time, both in the examples in DB/DR and in posts here, that the WAS will often pull back after a period of closeness, the degree to which is usually determined by the amount of "closeness". In your case, the ML and the "good times" at the wedding probably confused her to no end and she's regrouping to see what she really wants. That's just a guess but I would NOT read anything into it. Go to the game, have a GREAT time and try to keep your mind focused on what you KNOW, that you are trying the best you can, you love your kid(s) and W and you WILL become stronger/better through this.
Oh, and I am REALLY glad to hear you making progress through reading DB. I am a little confused, did you say you DID read the rest of the other book (which BTW, if it's His Needs/Her needs, is a book I hear recommended here a lot I just think it has some "un-DB"ish things in it) and it "got you somewhere"? I don't really follow where "it" got you. Please elaborate or correct my misunderstanding.
Oh, and I am REALLY glad to hear you making progress through reading DB. I am a little confused, did you say you DID read the rest of the other book (which BTW, if it's His Needs/Her needs, is a book I hear recommended here a lot I just think it has some "un-DB"ish things in it) and it "got you somewhere"? I don't really follow where "it" got you. Please elaborate or correct my misunderstanding.
His Needs/Her Needs was the first book I was reading before I discovered DB. W and I actually read a few chapters together and she kind of lost interest in it because most of the stuff it talked about we already know and/or does not apply to our R. So I read the rest of it and the last part of the book, I think the chapter is called "How To Survive an Affair", it talked about the authors stand on ending the A, what the WAS is supposed to do and what the BS is supposed to expect. It also talked about total discontinuation of communication between WAS and OP and that if it calls for it a temporary separation might be in order to spare the BS from any further pain and suffering since the A is ongoing. This last part of the book got me nowhere because it's unDBish as you call it. It kind of pushed her away yesterday, hence the being "quiet" again. We haven't talked about separation in almost two weeks and here it was brought up again.
As I posted earlier, I did tell W that I don't want a separation, temporary or whatever. I don't know if she got to thinking about where this is going, our R and her R with the OM. Again, I don't want to do mind reading. I'll just have to move forward... again.
Well, I think most sources would agree that there needs to be a "no contact" rule when the affair ends. The point of major contention between the "experts" is how to best go about that time when the affair is ongoing. I would say many experts out there say that there needs to be an end to the affair before anything else happens and advocate the forced ending of the affair if at all possible.
What is being suggested, as far as you have posted it, is that you are NOT forcing an end to the affair by asking her to leave, or leaving, you are protecting yourself from more pain. To a certain extent, I think this is somewhat viable, even by DB standards because it is not so much an ultimatum as you TRULY giving her the space she's no doubt asking for.
So, in that respect, I see where the author is going with that. I still think it's best not to put such things on the table unless you REALLY want them to happen because they may very well do just that.
Please, do move forward and like I said, keep reading just make sure you have YOUR goals firmly in mind when you do.
