Hi Paul, Have been following along for quite a while and I am still pulling for you. Has she asked for a D? Has she filed? If not, why not stay the course? Did she have a reaction to the “tough love” letter? Ignoring you and being mad are not necessarily bad – may show she is still conflicted. If she has not filed then that is also positive. It takes a long time to change one’s feelings – especially if she is dealing with the guilt of an affair which she most likely is trying within her to also blame you for.
A custody fight is ugly but if you want 50% then make it clear that is your boundary. That is what I am going to do. If she thinks she can flaunt an affair in front of her children without their father being concerned, she is living in a different reality. Check with a lawyer so see your options. There may a chance to even get or threaten her with sole custody, but your AA may make that a bit more difficult. I don’t know about Australia, but women having affairs don’t go well even in southern U.S. where the mom almost automatically gets custody.
-------------------------------- When will I be able to go through a day without thinking of her? When will I be able to stop dreaming of her? When will she wake up and ask me to come back home? -------------------------------
I go through this every day Paul. Seven months now. I too am thinking of giving up but somehow I soldier on. She is going to file – not me. Good luck.
Thanks Jeff, Australia has a no fault divorce system. You have to have been seperated 12 months before you can apply for a divorce. I have asked W to start looking into division of assets as I cannot afford to pay 1/2 our mortgage, my rent and other bills I've inherited. I figure that if she wants the single life she can pay for it. Australia makes it easy for single mums, at the moment she gets $500 a week of the government plus what I give her for child support plus any mortgage payment I give her. I earn $500 and have been giving her $210 leaving %290 to pay rent, credit cards, bike payments and food/petrol.
Recently found a site over here called dadsindistress that supports fathers that cannot get custody. Site says that 5 males suicide a day in australia. The fathers in these broken marriages are treated like second class citizens by falmily law and Child Support Agency. Things are slowly changing but too slowly for some. Looking at there forum it seems to me that there are a lot of bitter men out there. Maybe the should all look at this site and try DBing.
Thanks again Jeff, good luck in your sitch and good luck to all DBers.
Same here Paul. My W is at her lawyer executing our D papers as we speak. Even in my state (Alabama), although there is a joint custody “preference” the dads get the shaft most of the time. The “law” is not worth the paper it is written on. Unless you can prove the mom is “unfit” you have a very uphill battle. I will go for 50% custody but most likely will be wasting my money and time.
My W was very agreeable up until now but emotionally she could not go through with drafting up her own D agreements. So now the lawyers are involved which will lead to no good for anyone involved – especially my kids. Try to solve as much as you can before the wolves show up.
Quote: I will go for 50% custody but most likely will be wasting my money and time.
Went to Dads in Distress meeting tonight. Was alot better than I thought it would be. Gave me alot of advice, some was very similar to what we know from DBing. One piece of advice they gave me regarding custody was keep a diary of any times you have the children or take them on outings. The diary will be admissable in court, if it gets that far. You can work on the W's perception of you through others ie. relatives, mutual friends and of course the children.
Am glad I went to the meeting and will be a regular attendee I reckon. The old hands there knew of MLC and were pro marriage as well as suportive if and when the M is totally over.
Feel better about the sitch, now I have found another lifeline.
Fathers day next Sunday. Will be having the children round Saterday night so they can make me breakfast in bed for f.day. Kids wanted me to have a sleep over at the family home that night but I declined. I really feel like I'm an intruder in my own home lately. Every time I leave after a visit I feel down in the dumps.
Will have to sort out some sort of access agreement with W so kids can stay with me more often.
This detaching and letting go of W really sucks, but I'm getting to a point where I do not want to see or talk to W now. She seems to be avoiding me like the plague whenever I go round to see kids. Last Saterday I visited and W took off to visit friends within 5 min. of me arriving.
This Sunday there is a bbq at inlaws for all of the extended family. Told D13 I didn't want to go and her and other children could go somewhere with me instead. D was most upset and phoned W bawling. Really wish I had handled my emotions better and hadn't said I didnt want to go so she hadnt needed to phone W about it, but it's done now. Decided I will go and make the most of it, have to act as if I'm fine having a great time with my new single status. Should I take my new girlfriend? ( thats a joke folks )
Will try to show W and her rellies that I'm getting on fine with my life, plenty of PMA and things are going really well for me. I should be shoo-in for an Oscar if I can pull it off.
Good luck to all fighting the good fight.
Paul.
IF YOU SEE HER SAY HELLO - BOB DYLAN
If you see her, say hello, she might be in Tangier She left here last early spring, is livin' there, I hear Say for me that I'm all right though things get kind of slow She might think that I've forgotten her, don't tell her it isn't so.
We had a falling-out, like lovers often will And to think of how she left that night, it still brings me a chill And though our separation, it pierced me to the heart She still lives inside of me, we've never been apart.
If you get close to her, kiss her once for me I always have respected her for busting out and gettin' free Oh, whatever makes her happy, I won't stand in the way Though the bitter taste still lingers on from the night I tried to make her stay.
I see a lot of people as I make the rounds And I hear her name here and there as I go from town to town And I've never gotten used to it, I've just learned to turn it off Either 'm gettiI'm too sensitive or else In' soft.
Sundown, yellow moon, I replay the past I know every scene by heart, they all went by so fast If she's passin' back this way, I'm not that hard to find Tell her she can look me up if she's got the time.
Anyone out there who has a W that has gone all New Age on them? Mine has, tells me we have lived nine past lives together. In the last one I killed all her family and took her as a trophy back to my village and my previous difficulties in this life with her brothers and sisters is because of what I did to her family in that previous life. She was happily married to OM in one of her previous lives. The female business partner she has at the moment in this life was her mother in a past life and they were both burnt at the stake in that life. It goes on and on.
So I dont really know if she is going through a mid life crisis, a previous life crisis or both.
Whatever it is I hope she comes out of it sometime, preferably in this life. I guess people are allowed to have their own beliefs but this stuff has affected her, the kids and myself in very negative ways.
She likes to get readings done and seems to take what she is told, provided it agrees with her current mindset, as the way things are and are going to be.
The word delusional keeps cropping up in my head. I guess all I can do at this time is totally detach and understand that it is quite likely that she, the woman I have been married to for 17 going on 18 years next month, may never come back to reality.
She has become very distant towards me and I have been trying to give her as much space as I can. Any talk of me wanting/getting part custody of the children only gets hostile reactions from her.
I don't want to give up but she seems to be moving futher away all the time and I havent seen any improvement in the sitch in fact things seem to be getting worse.
She seems to have surrounded herself with a bunch of friends that are as out there as she herself is and they all seem to be encouraging each other in this stuff.
Oh well I can only hope and pray that she comes back to reality and work on my own life and my relationship with the children.
Went out with W the other day for coffe at the beach and we talked a bit, nothing too heavy, no animosity shown. W talked abit about how the M progressed through the last 4-5 years and how my drinking had affected her & family.
W said it was a pity it took her to finally decide she didn't love me and to give up on M before I could stop the drinking. I replied that if any thing positive has come out of this it was me quitting, nearly eight months now.
W has not gone any further with splitting assets, hasn't seen a lawyer or anything yet. Original OM has backed off from W a bit with a big attack of the guilts. His W knows nothing about W and him. Asked W if she was planning on starting D proceedings in April as that would be the 12 month seperation mark and she replied that she will not be filling unless she or I meet some one we wanted to marry. I advised that I would not be persuing one either. She stated that D papers are just a bit of paper (so is a M certificate I guess). So that left me thinking WTF.
W asked me to look after kids Saterday as she wants to go to Gold Coast with friends, turns out it is with a new OM. She says he is just a friend and is not interested in him romantically. I said yes I will be looking forward to spending the time with the kids. Didn't let on that her seeing new bloke is breaking my heart. Kept up with the positive outward appearances. Just trying to appear positive and rebuild friendship with W, no pressure or needieness or clinging or guilt trips.
Yesterday W was telling me how bad her financial situation is. she has bills totalling over $1500 due next week and no $'s to pay them with and is still going away on weekend.
I picked kids up from school in the family car and she had left her bag in the car, couldn't help my self and had a look inside. My W who never allowed me to use condoms now carries one in her purse, for emergencies guess. Seeng it caused me a bit of grief but I am holding it in and will not be confronting her about it. None of my business I guess.
So things are not really looking good at the moment. I know I cannot make her do anything and feel quite powerless with this whole situation. All I can do is continue to be supportive, maintain/build upon the friendship and keep working on myself.
I am not quitting at this stage. We have our 18th wedding anniversary comming up next weekend and I really don't know what to do about it, send her a card, ignore it or play it by ear. Given that she had a dinner date on valintines day, a breakfast date on fathers day she will probably be out with an OM on the day of the anniversary too.
I had the kids here overnight last Saterday so I had them for the morning of fathers day, her family had a bbq on the Sunday with all her extnded family in attendance I dropped kids off and hung around for about 1/2 hour then took off. Didn't want to be there as seeing all the other happy dads in there happy family situations would not have helped me.
This DBing is getting to be a big drain on my mental well being but my W is worth it, my children deserve it and so do I. Looks like I'm in for the long haul.
Lot of positives here. Not wanting a D less she falls “in love” is big. With her self-esteem low and the guilt of using you and the kids while she is off “finding herself” I doubt she will find anyone soon. But watching her date must suck. You seem to be doing everything right as far as DB is concerned: giving her plenty of space and supporting her as she finds herself. You are right, we are both in this for the long haul.
I may have to move back into my house to protect my custody rights. My lawyer said moving was not a good idea if I want 50/50 custody. If it goes to trial I am looking at a 12 to 18 month wait. I would rather be stay separated – life is good right now and my attitude is positive – that may change if I have to see her everyday in the same house.
Excellent job on the drinking, especially given the situation. I cut back a lot. In fact, my doc told me my liver function is back to normal; he was quite concerned about it a year ago. I find I don’t need it now; I read that my ‘triggers” for drinking were removed when I moved out; another reason not to go back uninvited.
From your words you sound kind of drained and sad. I hope you are doing some fun things for you. I also hope you are detaching from W. My attitude is getting better and better – if we D or if we reconcile, I am almost past caring. Either way, I will have a good life and I will be a good dad to my kids.
Thanks Jeff, Yes watching her leaving for an over night date does suck. Took her to vote in local election and then took her to train station so she could meet up with date futher down track. Told her I'd wait for train with her as there can be alot of deadheads around train stations. Kept convo. light whilst waiting. Told her I hoped she has a great time etc. if she didn't want to stay the night to phone me and I'd come and get her. Nothing heavy. Got first hug in a long time as she boarded train, didn't let tears show till she had gone. She did txt me to tell me she'd arrived safely and again later to tell me people she was meeting up with were ok and she was comfortable staying the night. I replied both time 'good have a great time c u tomorrow'. Have suggested that we go somewhere next weekend (our anniversary next sunday) but will not be preassuring her about it or buying anni. present, might just give her a card to say thanks for the years together. What do you think?
Any males out there read 'No More Mr Nice Guy' by Robert A Glover. I was mentioned on this forum and I was wondering if anyone had any success in their sit. by becoming an intergrated male.
Feel that being too nice all the time is making me feel abit like a doormat. Actually having mixed feelings alot lately. One moment I'm all for keeping up the DBing next I'm all for giving up totally and telling her to go and get f%^&ed. I know I won't, but the feeling keeps coming back, it is only nine months post bomb and going on 5 months separated.
Whan is she going to see that the changes I've made are not just temporary. Probably never. I think she will just keep on dating other people, can't see that she will find someone to take on four dependant school age children in a hurry. Hopefully that fact will work in my favour.
Oh well good luck to all fighting the good fight. Paul
Feel I've done all I can in regard to changing the old Paul to The New Paul. W needs to be the one to change now.
journaling, Well no change in my situation. It still sucks. W has seen bank about splitting our assets, mainly just the equity on the house. I said I'd just go for a third. She can have a 1/3 and 1/3 for kids. Basically I'll just get $23k, not really good for 18 years of marriage. Was 18th anniversary last Sunday Asked W if she wanted to do lunch or anything. She said she was probably going out with new boyfriend, so I didn't push to do anything. As I was leaving family home on the Friday I just said 'thanks for the time we had together and thanks for being such a great mother to the kids' . W seems to have completely forgotten about anni. Oh well. Talked W other day about things. She wanted to take kids with her and new BF to the beach for the day. I advised her that I didn't think it was right. The children have enough drams in their lives now without having to deal with this new man. W said if she were going with her female friends I would not have a problem with that would I. I just said that is what I think and I'm just letting you know how I feel about it. Didn't get emotional or angry or raise voice or any thing like that. She said she liked this fellow and they were just friends spending time together. She has told him she just wants to be friends and she has issues to deal with in her own life before she gets into any R with anyone. I reiterated that she was a married woman and it was not a good example to show the children going out with another man. W said we are separated and the M is over. I asked if she was going to file for D in April when the 12 sep. is up. She said She has no intention to file, as it's just a piece of paper. So I guess she looks at the marriage certificate as just a piece of paper too. I told her I am not going to file either.
All the so-called advice I seem to be getting from various people is to get over her and find a new lady and move on. I really don’t want to find a new lady. I thought I'd found and married the girl I was to grow old with. Where has this person gone, the woman I am seeing now looks like my W of 18 years but certainly doesn't act like her.
Well started a new job last week. That’s the 5th job since the bomb dropped. Nothing like a bit of variety, one day I’ll find something I like.
Had a run in with the landlord the other day. I am renting a room at his house and usually he is only there one or two night a week. As his lady friend is away for two weeks he is going to be at his place for those two weeks. He got back last night and asked me how it’s going with W. As I started explaining the deal with W & BF & kids going to beach he started cutting me off and telling me what I should have said. Not letting me answer his question. When I said ‘you just asked me a question and before I could answer started cutting in and telling me what to do, give me a chance to tell you before butting in’ He lost it and said maybe you should find somewhere else. It didn’t get right out of hand but I’m thinking maybe I should look at finding somewhere else. He is really set in his ways and is forever giving me unwanted advice (ie move on find another woman, don’t give her 2/3, go for ½ etc) and trying to tell me how to live my life( worse than my soon to be exW was, lol). Am not looking forward to interacting with him for the next two weeks, will just have to find things to do to get out of the house as much as I can.
Well 8 months without a drink, can’t believe it. I guess miracles do happen.
W’s MLC seems to be in full bloom. My life has changed beyond recognition these last 10 months. Still bet a bit morose every now and then. Am trying to stay positive around W. No neediness or clinginess. No need you want you. No showing anger or resentment towards her or new BF. This is hard stuff. The children give me a lot of comfort and it is hard not to talk to them about what’s going on. I don’t want to dump W & my dramas onto them or start trying to play them against W.
Eldest D decided not to go to beach with W & BF so am spending the day with her.
