I don't know your sitch, but maybe I can help with your question.
I will assume that your W already knows that you want to stay in your marriage, that you have already told her this, that you have already had some R talk with her. If so, then she already KNOWS that you want to stay married to her. What you SAY, as far as talking about the R right now, is not going to "change her mind." This is all about your actions. Go about making your relationship the best you possibly can WITHOUT TALKING ABOUT IT. I am sure that you can identify some behaviors that do not work with your W. What can you do instead? What are things that you see working that you can do more of?
In thinking about what is working, don't be looking to see if she is ready to jump back into the relationship with you as a guide. You need to list some goals, small ones. What will she be DOING that will tell you you are headed in the right direction? These are little things, baby steps.
Although you might think that R talk is the way to go, you need to resist it as much as you can. Your W will see by your actions that you care about her. There may be a time in the future when R talk will be OK, but that time is not now. Be patient, it can take a long time, but rest assured that the changes that you make will have an impact on your W and your relationship.
JJ
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I wanted to stop in and say that being separated doesn't mean the end to your M. My H moved out in April, 2001 and moved back in the beginning of June, 2002. I was one of the "lucky" ones in that I wasn't home when my H moved out. We had a huge argument on our cell phones that ended with him saying that was it he was leaving and my saying fine.
I was on my way to work and he stopped by long enough to tell me that he had packed all of his things and was moving in with his parents. Of course I cried when he told me this because I didn't think he would actually move out but looking back I personally feel that it was the best thing to happen to us.
I found this site and the DB book almost 4 months after my H moved out so I had 4 months worth of crying, begging and pleading already under my belt. I wish I had found this site when we first separated but it wasn't meant to be that way.
Through the help of my friends here I found out how to act "as if" everything was just fine between us when we saw each other or talked on the phone. I also made sure that I came here to vent whenever I felt the need.
What kinds of things do you like to do? You need to remember to take care of yourself and make yourself happy first. What things can you do that would be 180's for you? Sometimes it helps to list your goals/180's here so you can go back and re-read them if necessary and it helps us to help keep you on the path to your goals.
Good luck and do something just for yourself today.
Julie
JJ
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I, along with many others, can relate to what you are presently experiencing. Only those who have gone through this can understand the full impact of the pain and the disruption to one's life. The same goes for the process of DBing. Only those who have practiced the techniques can really know the strength, resolve, support and patience it requires.
Just as no two people are exactly alike, no two situations are exactly alike either, so it is not possible to say how long the process might take.
Reaching out on this bb, as you have begun to do, is going to be a tremendous factor in your recovery, this will be more and more obvious to you over time.
Take heart in knowing that some of the most hopeless looking situations have turned out to be great success stories. So read, read, read and be sure to post to your thread and to other's.
We're all here to help each other.
Jeannine
JJ
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Quote: I had lots of marriage goals, but narrowed it down to a few that are achievable within two weeks and then plan the next goals. My number one goal is that we recreate a marriage that is strong, passionate, and lasting. I should really write them up and carry them around with me.
* Hubby seeks counselling * I will be friendly and self-reliant * NO PRESSURE * Be clear about my goals for reconciliation
I am going to ask you rethink the changes you want to be seeing in the M that will give you some hope. Your goal of your R going to counseling is a great goal, but I am wondering if that is realistic for the short term? The other three you listed:
* I will be friendly and self-reliant * NO PRESSURE * Be clear about my goals for reconciliation
These are more about YOUR behavior changes and that’s great. But first, it is important that you know what you are watching for that says things are improving.
Once you get 2-3 specific, positive, and very realistic short-term goals (some things that could take place in the next few weeks), then take a look at what you can do (or not do!) to encourage your goals to happen.
IT WILL BE YOUR GOALS that will help you decide how to behave or what to say or not say. With each situation you have with your H, ask what types of behaviors or words will help you succeed.
By the way, if you’ve “trashed” your goals, I hope don’t get too down on yourself. No one does this perfectly, OK? Just get back up and keep doing what has been working. Remember that you knew even before you received DR, how to do relationship –saving behaviors! Keep it up, keep going, and you have my major support !!
Laurie
JJ
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There is hope at the end of the rollercoaster ride we are on. It is just going to take a while. You asked when is it going to end. Well know one knows that one for sure. It probably took a while to get to this point. And it will take a while to get back on track.
But as far as any tricks etc. Yes the trick is to do things for your self right now. Yes my H is still in the home. The only diffrence is that it never got to the point of I dont love you any more or the D talk.
But he was still distant and would pull away from me etc. I felt when we made love it seemed like he was just filling a need not really meaning it.
But things are starting to change and i thank god every day that they are. I focus on the small positives. And am learning to let the big negitives slide a little more easily.
The best thing for you to do. Is think about you for real. Not the day to day things you do. But the person that you have really become. Because even tho we didnt turn around and break the trust of our H/W. We still contributed to some degree what is going on.
Things I found out about my self when I really looked at my self.
1) I have become negitive.(changing that.) 2) I became subserviant to him not an equal to him. (changing that.) 3) I stoped thinking about my self. (changing that.) 4) I had become depressed. (trying to get help for that.) 5) Stoped listening. (working on that) 6) Became defensive. (changing that.)
See there were a couple things that he could see that I had changed about my self. But until I really looked at it all i saw is i am trying to do things to make you happy. Well they werent making him happy. Who wants to be around a person like that. Around my friends I was the postive,up beat,giving, caring,funny person that he married.
Not this other person I had become at home. And he would try to point these things out to me and I didnt understand or see what he was talking about till i really started to look at the things I was doing.
And the key is I didnt want to change these things for him. I wanted to change them for me and my chilren. Not to please him any more. To make a better life for my self.
Start doing things for you. Become stronger inside. Start a making goals for your self. I dont mean well today i am going to get the laundry done. I am going to make the kids beds. I am going to dust today. Not those kind of goals. Goals for your self.
Like today I am to spend some time reading that book I want to get finished. Today when he does blank i am not going to react to him in this way. Or when i feel like i need a hug today. I am going to go out and play with the dog. Or I am going to go for a walk. Or I am going to hug the kids instead. Or today I am going to dye my hair the color I want so that I can feel better about the way I look.
Those kind of things get to know your self. Do things for yourself. Yea there are still times like right now while i am posting here. The OS. just called for stuff for his work. But actually I am doing okay with it. When she called she treated me with respect and stuck to the business at hand. I went in told him about the phone call. And he asked if i was okay. Cause he knows how much it upsets me when she calls. And he was thinking about me. She was told not to call here ever gain no matter what was going on. But she refuses. But if i stay confident about our relationship. And that things are going good and i dont let her get to me she doesnt win. Cause she does it to test the waters on how things are going with me and him. Well if i act all paniced and pissed off and yell at him about it. Then she wins.
So stay strong and know that there is an end to this..
JJ
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Timeline? My suggestion would be to set a timeline for you personally - and I wouldn't make it 3 weeks. I would say I will give him 6 months to show some effort towards our marrige. If nothing has improved by then - then I will sit him down for a talk. You give him any type of ultimatum now and you might as well say goodbye. He isn't ready for it yet. You have to decide in your heart do you really truly love him, do you love him enough to endure this time of pain and struggle? Remember your marriage vows - through thick and thin - this is that point in your marrige that unfortunately is being tested. Try and keep yourself distracted as much as possible (without including him) so he can get to really miss you, wonder about you, what you are up to. I know you have questioned if you are letting him have best of both worlds? Perhaps, but again if you really want to give this marriage a shot - I say give it more time - and you set the timeline in your head or journal and see what happens after that point. One thing Iwould suggest (and you don't appear to be leaning this way) but I would not go out on any dates. You will only confuse your heart and head.
Hang in there! We are here for you!
Missy
JJ
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Okay here is some of what I learned and I hope it helps others:
1. Quiet, persistent, nondemanding loving by someone who loves himself or herself is almost impossible to resist.
2. Be aware of your own thoughts and visualizations as they can determine the course of your life. What we tell ourselves can affect the outcome of our interactions with others.
3. We all know that threats, begging, convincing chase a S away and are counterproductive for anyone seriously interested in salvaging a R.
4. To love is to pay heed to the needs of the person you love. When you resort to begging, convincing etc. you are only focusing on yourself.
5. When you feel overwhelmed by your own feelings and want to vent at your S regardless of the consequences ask yourself if what you are about to say is an expression of love or a need.
6. The anger that you feel at having been left by your S if not really about your S but rather has to do with you.
7. Remember the pleasant moments from your M. Opportunities to create more of these moments strenghten your R.
8. It is important to turn all encounters with your S into pleasant encounters even if the purpose of the encounter is unpleasant.
9. You cannot argue your lover back to you. Renewing your R with your S has little to do with being right and everything to do with mutual experience of pleasant or positive moments.
10. We can only control ourselves and our own actions.
11. Cursing, name calling, pouting, begging, accusing or demanding does not get your S back. Communication should be based on the awareness that your S has a point of view and then empathize with their point of view.
12. Relax and take care of yourself. Do not neglect friends, interests, excercise etc.
putter
JJ
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The problem with advise on "should I contact her more or wait until she contacts me?" is ... its different for each sitch. It all depends on the issues that brought you here and what you find works for you. It really trial & error and monitor closely to she how close you've come to what works best.
Since in my case one of the major factors for her to WA was because I didn't pay enough attention to her, so I would be the first to suggest doing something together acting "as-if" she would say yes, but would always have a back up plan. If she hesitatied or said no, I say no problem then I will then go do (plan B) and you're welcome to join me. If she still wasn't interested, then I would pleasantly excuse myself and go do my thing. After a while, I started getting calls at work from her, asking if I would want to meet up with her after work.
Try different variants of contact vs no contact to strike upon the right equation that works for you.
'til later, KAW
JJ
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Time, unfortunately, is something that you need to learn to deal with right now. Your W has not been gone long enough for significant change to take place with either of you. You need to work on yourself right now. You can't control your W or her actions, if you try to control her you will only be pushing her further away and possibly closer to the OM if there is one.
Be patient. Use the time wisely. Don't initiate contact with her. Right now you are your worst enemy. Control your emotions, especially the anger, and never say anything to hurt her. Right now, anything and everything you say and do will be remembered down the road. Think of your long term goal: to get your wife back.
The 180's that you must do involve paying close attention to your wife's words and actions. If something you do pisses her off or pushes her away, simply stop doing it. Yes, you will make mistakes along the way and backslide on occasion. Don't sweat it, just pick yourself up and continue DBing. Nobody ever said that this was easy, so you must work hard at it.
The feelings and emotions that you are going through right now are natural and will be helpful once you learn to control them.
I don't think it's time for LRT yet. But, you should not initiate contact with her. She is looking for time and space, you must respect that and give it to her. There will be times when she might try pressing your buttons as well, just something you need to be aware of. She will do it to try and validate what she is doing. She will look for and expect a reactive response. Don't let her suck you into that trap. Remain calm and let any crap she gives you slide off your back. The response I like to give goes something like this: "I understand that that's how you feel honey". And leave it at that.
I wish you the best of luck. We are here for you when you need help.
Take care.
Greg
JJ
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You're trying wayyyyy too hard buddy. Sometimes trying too hard can be as nonproductive as not trying at all.
Ever had a particular problem in school with a subject like, say math for instance, that you just could not solve? You spent many frustrating hours trying to work it out this way and that and then that way again only to come to a dead end? You pretty much gave up on the problem and went about other business for a few hours or even a few days, and lo and behold, the next time you looked at the problem the solution is right there staring you in the face and you wonder how something so simple could have eluded you the first time around. Does that make sense?
Take a break. Yes, this board can be addicting. Hell, my marriage is back on track and I still get sucked back to the board at least several times a month.
Take some time out for YOU. Life is short, go out and enjoy it!
G
JJ
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